John Hjorth Posted January 19 Posted January 19 3 minutes ago, WFF said: I know it is not politically correct, but pragmatically speaking, EU f’ed themselves for being so reliant on US services. They have “no cards” as Orange Drama Queen will say, are they really going to ban US services? So no AWS, no Google, no AI? ... Likely not that way, @WFF, But think in the line of government contracts and spending based on American procurement today, where there exists alternatives outside USA, i.e. like procurement in the global military Industrial complex. Norwegian politicians have already vented such ideas and are likely already now searching in the state budget for places for political sting operations, I'm sure. All from cancellations of contracts and procurement in progress to direct misc. harrassment of contractors. Just doing it across EU with EU military spending ramp-up going forward could really affect the US military industrial complex adversely. It's about a lot of billions of USD. It's according the melody : 'If he can, so can we!' Remember, this is politicians!
Sweet Posted January 19 Posted January 19 1 hour ago, Luke said: There was a huge net value creation for the planet - to call it a mistake to help China develop is IMO not a correct assesment when you think of overall human development. Sure - for some billionaires that owned monopolies in the west this development was not ideal because there is competition. I wouldn’t have a problem is China was a liberal democracy, but they aren’t. I couldn’t give a crap about net value creation when it comes to these things.
WFF Posted January 19 Posted January 19 57 minutes ago, John Hjorth said: Likely not that way, @WFF, But think in the line of government contracts and spending based on American procurement today, where there exists alternatives outside USA, i.e. like procurement in the global military Industrial complex. Norwegian politicians have already vented such ideas and are likely already now searching in the state budget for places for political sting operations, I'm sure. All from cancellations of contracts and procurement in progress to direct misc. harrassment of contractors. Just doing it across EU with EU military spending ramp-up going forward could really affect the US military industrial complex adversely. It's about a lot of billions of USD. It's according the melody : 'If he can, so can we!' Remember, this is politicians! Yes, some industries will be hurt. Defense is one of them, autos (Big 3), bourbon, aircraft , etc. But is this enough to deter? And are there really no markets to send the cancel US demand elsewhere (cough… Taiwan, Saudi?) Playing the devils advocate, is EU’s defense industry able to capture these “cancelled” demand? When can they deliver and at what cost? By doing so, EU is potentially hurting themselves in the process (less bang for the buck). Structurally, it’s going to be like China favoring domestic production, but in the short term can’t the gap really be filled? Any actions, the US could take opposite actions to help offset likely (which in some sense is already happening). Longer term, they may wait until the midterms to reassess, and even longer and wait until after Trump’s presidency. So the correct statement is the EU have cards, just don’t seems like any good ones (like China’s rare earth).
73 Reds Posted January 19 Posted January 19 17 minutes ago, WFF said: Yes, some industries will be hurt. Defense is one of them, autos (Big 3), bourbon, aircraft , etc. But is this enough to deter? And are there really no markets to send the cancel US demand elsewhere (cough… Taiwan, Saudi?) Playing the devils advocate, is EU’s defense industry able to capture these “cancelled” demand? When can they deliver and at what cost? By doing so, EU is potentially hurting themselves in the process (less bang for the buck). Structurally, it’s going to be like China favoring domestic production, but in the short term can’t the gap really be filled? Any actions, the US could take opposite actions to help offset likely (which in some sense is already happening). Longer term, they may wait until the midterms to reassess, and even longer and wait until after Trump’s presidency. So the correct statement is the EU have cards, just don’t seems like any good ones (like China’s rare earth). @WFF Quit being so sensible. The problem most of the World has with the US is not Trump; it is that they are always telling the US what is and isn't good for the US while they largely ignore their own issues. Meanwhile, for 250 years and counting the US has done a pretty good job looking out for itself while also protecting the rest of the World from itself. Military procurement is far from the top of anyone's list of current priorities in the US - precisely the way it should be.
Sweet Posted January 19 Posted January 19 36 minutes ago, 73 Reds said: The problem most of the World has with the US is not Trump; it is that they are always telling the US what is and isn't good for the US while they largely ignore their own issues. It's amazing that's your take away... read the thread. It's most definitely, at the moment, Trump. In other times, I would largely agree.
John Hjorth Posted January 19 Posted January 19 (edited) 39 minutes ago, 73 Reds said: ... The problem most of the World has with the US is not Trump; it is that they are always telling the US what is and isn't good for the US while they largely ignore their own issues. .... Meanwhile, for 250 years and counting the US has done a pretty good job looking out for itself while also protecting the rest of the World from itself. Military procurement is far from the top of anyone's list of current priorities in the US - precisely the way it should be. ... What do you really know for a fact about that?, @73 Reds, To me, the above is just one those eternal generalizations from US citizens, I experience posted almost every day [, perhaps it's not every day, but only several times a week], here on CofB&F. I simply don't get how can you even post so when POTUS want to boost US military spending materially? - - - o 0 o - - - Edit : I see @Sweet beating me to it here with less than an inch. Edited January 19 by John Hjorth
Spekulatius Posted January 19 Posted January 19 New season of “The man in the high Castle “is out apparently.
dealraker Posted January 19 Posted January 19 (edited) 1 hour ago, 73 Reds said: @WFF Quit being so sensible. The problem most of the World has with the US is not Trump; it is that they are always telling the US what is and isn't good for the US while they largely ignore their own issues. Meanwhile, for 250 years and counting the US has done a pretty good job looking out for itself while also protecting the rest of the World from itself. Military procurement is far from the top of anyone's list of current priorities in the US - precisely the way it should be. Hmm...if this was anyone but you Reds I call this one hell of a lazy brain perspective. Does make me want to yawn and go back to bed. Edited January 19 by dealraker
73 Reds Posted January 19 Posted January 19 10 minutes ago, John Hjorth said: What do you really know for a fact about that?, @73 Reds, To me, the above is just one those eternal generalizations from US citizens, I experience posted almost every day [, perhaps it's not every day, but only several times a week], here on CofB&F. I simply don't get how can you even post so when POTUS want to boost US military spending materially? - - - o 0 o - - - Edit : I see @Sweet beating me to it here with less than an inch. John, many here can turn your post right around at you - generalizations. You also assume you understand Trump when the reality is, you haven't a clue. No disrespect. He isn't a war-monger, much more a pragmatist trying to accomplish what he can (and what the voters wanted him to do) before the clock runs out. Politics here being what it is, you either accept the status quo and wait for the next guy to show up or try to change the course of history undeterred by others. "The sky is falling" has become a daily refrain here and like "The boy who cried wolfe", hardly generates even a yawn of reaction. What a lot of people don't seem to understand is our economy is good, our money is good and it is not in the best interest of the Western World to do anything to intentionally undermine the US because you would only be hurting yourselves in the long run.
73 Reds Posted January 19 Posted January 19 3 minutes ago, dealraker said: Hmm...if this was anyone but you Reds I call this one hell of a lazy brain perspective. Does make me want to yawn and go back to bed. Your comment gets a pass today on MLK day.
Sweet Posted January 19 Posted January 19 7 minutes ago, 73 Reds said: What a lot of people don't seem to understand is our economy is good, our money is good and it is not in the best interest of the Western World to do anything to intentionally undermine the US because you would only be hurting yourselves in the long run. What do you mean by this by intentionally undermine the US? Can you give an example.
73 Reds Posted January 19 Posted January 19 3 minutes ago, Sweet said: What do you mean by this by intentionally undermine the US? Can you give an example. Trade deals with China? Calling NATO "dead" if we pursue Greenland? Shall I go on?
Sweet Posted January 19 Posted January 19 (edited) 19 minutes ago, 73 Reds said: Trade deals with China? Calling NATO "dead" if we pursue Greenland? Shall I go on? Canada made a trade deal with China because Trump tariffed Canada. I don't agree with the Canadian decision, but who instigated the fight? 'Pursuing Greenland' - is that a sanitised way of give me Greenland or I will tariff you, and may even try and annex it? Have you considered that the Trump might be undermining the 'Western World', specifically his European and Canadian partners? Yes please, more examples of Western countries undermining the US... Edited January 19 by Sweet
SharperDingaan Posted January 19 Posted January 19 (edited) Re Greenland, Orange Boy is intentionally winding Europe up, setting the game, and doing very well at it. So ... change the game, get in his face, and wind him up. He can't afford retaliatory tariffs; he loses the midterms, he's gone .. so call the bluff .... and give him a shove. Engage the bazooka, deploy forces to Greenland on training exercises, use Trumps language and slap immediate additional tariffs on US goods/services to pay for that Greenland defence . Intentionally reduce US bond holdings, physically pull bullion out of the US, suck the oxygen out of the room. Unemployment and recession just in time for the midterms ... Hard ass actions behind the barn, the more ruthless the better. Ultimately, Greenlander's will decide what's best for them; however there's nothing wrong with greatly increasing the negative carry on the deal, should Greenlanders choose to become another US territory or state . Leaders come and go, but ya gotta stand up for yourself. There are lots of shrinks and docs/dentists around to mend bruised egos and repair broken bones and teeth. SD Edited January 19 by SharperDingaan
Spooky Posted January 19 Posted January 19 7 minutes ago, SharperDingaan said: Re Greenland, Orange Boy is intentionally winding Europe up, setting the game, and doing very well at it. So ... change the game, get in his face, and wind him up. He can't afford retaliatory tariffs; he loses the midterms, he's gone .. so call the bluff .... and give him a shove. Engage the bazooka, deploy forces to Greenland on training exercises, use Trumps language and slap immediate additional tariffs on US goods/services to pay for that Greenland defence . Intentionally reduce US bond holdings, physically pull bullion out of the US, suck the oxygen out of the room. Unemployment and recession just in time for the midterms ... Hard ass actions behind the barn, the more ruthless the better. Ultimately, Greenlander's will decide what's best for them; however there's nothing wrong with greatly increasing the negative carry on the deal, should Greenlanders choose to become another US territory or state . Leaders come and go, but ya gotta stand up for yourself. There are lots of shrinks and docs/dentists around to mend bruised egos and repair broken bones and teeth. SD Well said. Europe needs to stop kissing Trump's ass and start playing hardball. It is the only thing he respects.
Spooky Posted January 19 Posted January 19 36 minutes ago, 73 Reds said: Trade deals with China? Calling NATO "dead" if we pursue Greenland? Shall I go on? NATO already feels dead. The trust is gone and it will be hard to replace. The trade deal with China is a direct result of the US's irrational trade decisions. The US undermining itself, it is shooting itself in the foot. Xi and Putin must be waking up with a smile everyday.
Gregmal Posted January 19 Posted January 19 1 minute ago, Spooky said: Well said. Europe needs to stop kissing Trump's ass and start playing hardball. It is the only thing he respects. Eh, not sure they are kissing his ass. All these EU clowns have ever done, even going back to term 1, was undermine him, and gossip/manufacture drama/"offense" to anything he does, because they want the good old days back...which they got briefly with Biden...where they "kiss ass" and let the US take center stage while paying for everything...The EU as a whole is a bunch of spoiled brat freeloaders, basically trust fund kids, whom are used to the snob club atmosphere of Davos....
Spooky Posted January 19 Posted January 19 1 minute ago, Gregmal said: Eh, not sure they are kissing his ass. All these EU clowns have ever done, even going back to term 1, was undermine him, and gossip/manufacture drama/"offense" to anything he does, because they want the good old days back...which they got briefly with Biden...where they "kiss ass" and let the US take center stage while paying for everything...The EU as a whole is a bunch of spoiled brat freeloaders, basically trust fund kids, whom are used to the snob club atmosphere of Davos.... I mean the leader of NATO called Trump "Daddy". Trump and half his cabinet are going to Davos.
Gregmal Posted January 19 Posted January 19 Just now, Spooky said: I mean the leader of NATO called Trump "Daddy". Trump and half his cabinet are going to Davos. NATO is a meaningless entity also run by....the US, for all intents and purposes. The real "problem" is the EU and its leaders/ideological bullshit.
John Hjorth Posted January 19 Posted January 19 17 minutes ago, 73 Reds said: John, many here can turn your post right around at you - generalizations. You also assume you understand Trump when the reality is, you haven't a clue. No disrespect. He isn't a war-monger, much more a pragmatist trying to accomplish what he can (and what the voters wanted him to do) before the clock runs out. Politics here being what it is, you either accept the status quo and wait for the next guy to show up or try to change the course of history undeterred by others. "The sky is falling" has become a daily refrain here and like "The boy who cried wolfe", hardly generates even a yawn of reaction. What a lot of people don't seem to understand is our economy is good, our money is good and it is not in the best interest of the Western World to do anything to intentionally undermine the US because you would only be hurting yourselves in the long run. @73 Reds, You obviously got me wrong here. I don't understand him, nor have I ever alleged that I understand him. He is simply put totally differently wired than me. I not going to get closer to an analysis of him, because that's outside my professional circle of competence, I'm not a shrink, or anything alike. So, if you take notice, carefully, I don't dub him, put him in certain categories, nor am I name calling him. The basic facts are that he is elected by the American population, which does not include me. So in this topic, I don't comment on US internal affairs, at all, within the last year, or so, after being called out on it by a fellow CofB&F member. That does not change the fact that his decisions and actions in a material way has implications for my my future living conditions, because of : the way the net worth of my family, my household, and my own net worth is invested, allocated, and lately, his decisions and doings for sure are affecting my future taxes. It's that basic, simple. So, No voting right, but lots of skin in the game. First bullet likely - in all modesty - to a much higher degree than 'Mr. & Mrs. Jones' in Denmark, that here in Denmark is dubbed 'Mr. & Mrs. Jensen', locally. - - - o 0 o - - - That's why I'm only posting here in this topic related to such matters, which also include the decisions and doings by the autocrat to the East of here, perhaps also some times an acid burb about politics in 'cosy Denmark', which is - like any other country - far from perfect in its design and structure.
73 Reds Posted January 19 Posted January 19 25 minutes ago, Sweet said: Canada made a trade deal with China because Trump tariffed Canada. I don't agree with the Canadian decision, but who instigated the fight? 'Pursuing Greenland' - is that a sanitised way of give me Greenland or I will tariff you, and may even try and annex it? Have you considered that the Trump might be undermining the 'Western World', specifically his European and Canadian partners? Yes please, more examples of Western countries undermining the US... Europe's saber rattling while otherwise sitting idly by while Russia attacked Ukraine? Or how about European leaders' near-constant criticism every time the US supports the Middle East's only democracy in its right to exist? I could go on and on but no more click bait please.
Gregmal Posted January 19 Posted January 19 (edited) Trumps behaving like a buffoon because he knows Europes leaders are feckless idiots who are lazy and ultimately won’t do shit. If they wouldnt do anything to Big Bad Vlad in Ukraine, you really think they’ll do anything in Greenland? European leaders rule with an iron fist through book reports and regulations, not military might. Edited January 19 by Gregmal
Spooky Posted January 19 Posted January 19 5 minutes ago, Gregmal said: NATO is a meaningless entity also run by....the US, for all intents and purposes. The real "problem" is the EU and its leaders/ideological bullshit. If only more of this anger against Europe could be directed at Russia or China. Seems to me those are the real "problem".
cwericb Posted January 19 Posted January 19 Just now, Spooky said: If only more of this anger against Europe could be directed at Russia or China. Seems to me those are the real "problem". Yeah, but Vlad and Xi are Donnie's best friends and everything he is presently doing is to their advantage. That's what happens when leaders meet behind closed doors and agree on how to divide up the world between them. "Vlad, you take the Ukraine and do what you want with Europe. Xi, you can have Taiwan, the Philippines and do what you want with Japan and I'll take the Caribbean, Greenland and Canada. We can discuss the rest of the world after I get the Peace Prize"
dwy000 Posted January 19 Posted January 19 1 hour ago, Sweet said: Canada made a trade deal with China because Trump tariffed Canada. I don't agree with the Canadian decision, but who instigated the fight? 'Pursuing Greenland' - is that a sanitised way of give me Greenland or I will tariff you, and may even try and annex it? Have you considered that the Trump might be undermining the 'Western World', specifically his European and Canadian partners? Yes please, more examples of Western countries undermining the US... Not to mention all of these are specifically responding to Trump's stupidity. Its not the US they suddenly have problems with, it is Trumps actions.
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