President-Elect Trump trades

[Milu]

8 minutes ago, Buckeye said:

Thank you Red for picking up the baton and carrying on the good fight!  Please don't forget that every Tapeworm who owns Bitcoin has a financial incentive to discuss this topic with you, trying to change your mind.  Where you and I are working for free

 

I think Blake really helped show us who these Bitcoin Bros (or Ho's?) are.  He talked about how he was really going to miss Buffet and how when he is gone, this country is going to need a financial lighthouse now more than ever. 

 

Well James immediately responded with our solution and has crowned Michael Saylor, one of the biggest pieces of shit in the world, as our next Warren Buffet!!  Phew, thank you James!! Buffet isn't even gone and James has found his replacement.  See how great Bitcoin is? 

 

Warren Buffet, with his decades and decades of thoughtful discussions and writings, on all aspects of life, will be replaced by the Bitcoin Ho's with their King Douchebag Saylor, who said everyone should sell everything they have and buy Bitcoin!  Of course he did, because it benefits him.  Saylor is Captain of the SS Shitstorm and he needs more passengers!!  Grab your oars everyone on COBF!!

 

By the way, did James every respond to the question about Satoshi writing him checks?  Of course he didn't, and he never will.  Because he has all of the answers (like the rest of them) and as soon as you press him on the details he disappears. It's the ball under the blanket with this crew.

 

Every 1/2 truth, is compounded by another 1/2 truth and another 1/2 truth.  Their Bitcoin is the solution to everthing, because once you buy it, the only thing left to do is to try to come up with reasons why it's so great, to try to try to entice others into bidding up their share.

 

Scumbags.

“Don’t tell me what you think, tell me what you have in your portfolio.”

― Nassim Nicholas Taleb, Skin in the Game

 

You seem to believe that only people who don't hold any bitcoin are able to ethically give an opinion, otherwise they would be talking their book. For me personally I put a lot more weight in a person's opinion if they actually have money on the line. 

[Buckeye]

9 minutes ago, james22 said:

I'm out.

 

Enjoy being poor.

There it is...no answer! His non-answer tells us everything we need to know, doesn't it.  He's off to find other converts, because that's what he needs for his Bitcoin investment to work out.  He'll be back because he is financially incentivized to do so.  

Edited November 12 by Buckeye

[Buckeye]

7 minutes ago, Milu said:

“Don’t tell me what you think, tell me what you have in your portfolio.”

― Nassim Nicholas Taleb, Skin in the Game

 

You seem to believe that only people who don't hold any bitcoin are able to ethically give an opinion, otherwise they would be talking their book. For me personally I put a lot more weight in a person's opinion if they actually have money on the line. 

Oh God, now we've got Milu showing up with his poor interpretation of Nassim Taleb's quote and then using that poor interpretation as his reason for why people should own Bitcoin.  Got it Milu, thanks!  It's like asking your barber if you need a haircut!!  (Which by the way is one of great Warren's quotes, but thankfully we have Michael Saylor to take his place!)

 

Milu doesn't even recognize his own bias and then he tells me (putting words in my mouth) that I "seem to believe that only people who don't hold any bitcoin are able to ethically give an opinion."  That is not what I have said at all Milu.  I am saying...hey we should be a little careful listening to these Tapeworms go on and on about Bitcoin, because converting more and more people into Bitcoin is the only way their Bitcoin goes up in price. That's all.  Is that a false statement?

 

And then Milu says that he puts a lot weight into someone's opinion when they have a financial incentive.  Wow, that is a really dumb comment Milu.  But ok, you do you.

 

This is all starting to feel a little like Turds and Raisins

Edited November 12 by Buckeye

[John Hjorth]

4 minutes ago, james22 said:

I'm out.

 

Enjoy being poor.

 

James [ @james22 ],

 

Take it easy. 

 

Over the years [- now actually many years!, James], I've always enjoyed reading your posts here on CoBF. 

 

And I still do, while I'm personally not able to comprehend your posts about cryptocurrencies. And that's on me, not you. 

[Vish_ram]

23 minutes ago, 73 Reds said:

I am genuinely trying to understand the thought process behind valuing BTC.  There are no standards of valuation known to me that make any sense and "supply and demand" simply endorses the efficient market theory which essentially says that Buffett was simply lucky.  

 

Run a thought experiment where you go back in time 5000 years. You see in your kingdom Gold has been slowly introduced. The sharp buckeye calls it shitty metal due to its color. He rebukes it by saying it is too soft and useless. The Red guy is genuinely puzzled by the price and wonders how supply and demand affects it. 

 

The shitty coin despised by many is embraced by some die hards and call it Gold. They like the monetary aspect of it as the King was pushing more beads and diluting the purchasing power.  

 

Over time more and more people hoard it and it as a store of wealth. The increase in GDP/wealth of the kingdom got reflected into the price of the Gold (dont ask me how)

Edited November 12 by Vish_ram

[73 Reds]

14 minutes ago, Buckeye said:

Oh God, now we've got Milu showing up with his poor interpretation of Nassim Taleb's quote and then using that poor interpretation as his reason for why people should own Bitcoin.  Got it Milu, thanks!  It's like asking your barber if you need a haircut!!  (Which by the way is one of great Warren's quotes, but thankfully we have Michael Saylor to take his place!)

 

Milu doesn't even recognize his own bias and then he tells me (putting words in my mouth) that I "seem to believe that only people who don't hold any bitcoin are able to ethically give an opinion."  That is not what I have said at all Milu.  I am saying...hey we should be a little careful listening to these Tapeworms go on and on about Bitcoin, because converting more and more people into Bitcoin is the only way their Bitcoin goes up in price. That's all.  Is that a false statement?

 

And then Milu says that he puts a lot weight into someone's opinion when they have a financial incentive.  Wow, that is a really dumb comment Milu.  But ok, you do you.

 

This is all starting to feel a little like Turds and Raisins

Bottom line, is it unreasonable to question how owners of BTC value their investment?  What metrics or standards do they use?  Imagine if folks here were to recommend stocks solely on the basis of supply and demand and the last price?  Would that fly?

[Milu]

6 minutes ago, Buckeye said:

Oh God, now we've got Milu showing up with his poor interpretation of Nassim Taleb's quote and then using that poor interpretation as his reason for why people should own Bitcoin.  Got it Milu, thanks!  It's like asking your barber if you need a haircut!!  (Which by the way is one of Warren's quotes, but thankfully we have Michael Saylor to take his place!)

I don't think most people should own bitcoin. If I could find suitable equity investment options my personal preference would be to be 100% stocks. I don't actually like holding non-income generating assets like gold or bitcoin which I fully agree with you are hard if not impossible to value. I've just always held a large cash balance in my portfolio (30-50%) due to never being able to find reasonably priced stocks, a 15 year upward march in markets will do that. As I've seen governments continue to print money since 2009 and then went crazy with the money printer in covid I just wanted to get some of my paper money out of cash and into harder assets. This didn't mean I was putting all of my cash into gold and bitcoin, but I did put a small portion in. I don't believe Saylor is the new Buffett but he is taking a unique high risk approach that could pay off big time if he's right or bankrupt him if he's wrong. Microstrategy isn't a ride I'm willing to go along for like some of the other posters. I'll keep my bitcoin holding which grew from about 2% of portfolio when I invested in 2020 to about 14% today as I have a very simple thesis that it has a decent chance of getting to a similar market cap as gold. Doesn't mean that it's guaranteed to happen and I wouldn't be recommending my family and friends to buy bitcoin.\

 

Hope that clarifies things a bit, you and James22 are obvioulsly on very different sides of things and perhaps some of the nuance is being lost.

[Gregmal]

Ugh this thread is in the shitter….

 

Bitcoin is like gold, worthless unless people ascribe value to it. There’s no intrinsic value. 
 

What I’ve seen my entire life, is the people whom have largely an academic or textbook investment framework, have a very hard time coming around to the idea that something that doesn’t have easy plug ins can be worth anything. It can be a Picasso, a 1952 Mickey Mantle, a Football Club, a piece of Land, a vintage sports car, etc, they struggle with and most ultimately just give up and slap some derogatory name on it and call it a day.
 

The truth being, most of those alt investments, have been and will continue to be, extremely lucrative, largely because they are both popular, and also neglected. You either get it, or you don’t. 

[73 Reds]

1 minute ago, Gregmal said:

Ugh this thread is in the shitter….

 

Bitcoin is like gold, worthless unless people ascribe value to it. There’s no intrinsic value. 
 

What I’ve seen my entire life, is the people whom have largely an academic or textbook investment framework, have a very hard time coming around to the idea that something that doesn’t have easy plug ins can be worth anything. It can be a Picasso, a 1952 Mickey Mantle, a Football Club, a piece of Land, a vintage sports car, etc, they struggle with and most ultimately just give up and slap some derogatory name on it and call it a day.
 

The truth being, most of those alt investments, have been and will continue to be, extremely lucrative, largely because they are both popular, and also neglected. You either get it, or you don’t. 

OK, but it is possible to "get it" with collectibles, sports and entertainment franchises, etc... and still not comprehend BTC.

[Gregmal]

3 minutes ago, 73 Reds said:

OK, but it is possible to "get it" with collectibles, sports and entertainment franchises, etc... and still not comprehend BTC.

Of course lol

[Longnose]

8 minutes ago, Gregmal said:

Ugh this thread is in the shitter….

+1 - take it over to the crypto currency thread and it will die. 

[73 Reds]

11 minutes ago, Vish_ram said:

 

Run a thought experiment where you go back in time 5000 years. You see in your kingdom Gold has been slowly introduced. The sharp buckeye calls it shitty metal due to its color. He rebukes it by saying it is too soft and useless. The Red guy is genuinely puzzled by the price and wonders how supply and demand affects it. 

 

The shitty coin despised by many is embraced by some die hards and call it Gold. They like the monetary aspect of it as the King was pushing more beads and diluting the purchasing power.  

 

Over time more and more people hoard it and it as a store of wealth. The increase in GDP/wealth of the kingdom got reflected into the price of the Gold (dont ask me how)

And how has gold performed as an investment over time?  (No need to answer that!)

[rkbabang]

2 minutes ago, Gregmal said:

Ugh this thread is in the shitter….

 

Bitcoin is like gold, worthless unless people ascribe value to it. There’s no intrinsic value. 
 

What I’ve seen my entire life, is the people whom have largely an academic or textbook investment framework, have a very hard time coming around to the idea that something that doesn’t have easy plug ins can be worth anything. It can be a Picasso, a 1952 Mickey Mantle, a Football Club, a piece of Land, a vintage sports car, etc, they struggle with and most ultimately just give up and slap some derogatory name on it and call it a day.
 

The truth being, most of those alt investments, have been and will continue to be, extremely lucrative, largely because they are both popular, and also neglected. You either get it, or you don’t. 

 

Yes.  If I can't plug it into some formula I learned in school then I can't value it so it's valueless.   What also limits the ability to value it is that it is a one off, like the Picasso (this statement will be misinterpreted in a few minutes I'm sure).   There are no comparables.   There is no other crypto that is comparable to Bitcoin.  Eventually there will be a way to value it that will be thought in schools and then it will be ok.   But it will also be far more stable and probably only rise (or fall) in purchasing power every year around the rate of the growth in the world's economy.  It will eventually be a stable store of value, indeed the very measure of value, but when that happens the time to make a fortune from it will be long past.

 

[73 Reds]

2 minutes ago, rkbabang said:

 

Yes.  If I can't plug it into some formula I learned in school then I can't value it so it's valueless.   What also limits the ability to value it is that it is a one off, like the Picasso (this statement will be misinterpreted in a few minutes I'm sure).   There are no comparables.   There is no other crypto that is comparable to Bitcoin.  Eventually there will be a way to value it that will be thought in schools and then it will be ok.   But it will also be far more stable and probably only rise (or fall) in purchasing power every year around the rate of the growth in the world's economy.  It will eventually be a stable store of value, indeed the very measure of value, but when that happens the time to make a fortune from it will be long past.

 

My last post on this thread:  

 

<<Eventually there will be a way to value it>>  This shows me that there is no way to value BTC now.  So there is no way to tell whether the price you pay is reasonable, or not.  Therefore BTC today is simply a bet, a gamble or speculation.  If so, I get it, good luck, but I'm out.

[rkbabang]

1 minute ago, 73 Reds said:

My last post on this thread:  

 

<<Eventually there will be a way to value it>>  This shows me that there is no way to value BTC now.  So there is no way to tell whether the price you pay is reasonable, or not.  Therefore BTC today is simply a bet, a gamble or speculation.  If so, I get it, good luck, but I'm out.

You clipped my sentence in half.  You should work for the corporate press.

 

"Eventually there will be a way to value it that will be thought in schools and then it will be ok."

 

 

[rkbabang]

I've said probably 10s of times on this board that:

 

1) Bitcoin will eventually be the standard by which all of humanity values everything.

2) If you don't think this is true then you probably shouldn't own it.

 

[Luke]

1 hour ago, Buckeye said:

There it is...no answer! His non-answer tells us everything we need to know, doesn't it.  He's off to find other converts, because that's what he needs for his Bitcoin investment to work out.  He'll be back because he is financially incentivized to do so.  

Exactly. Its also very easy to engage in this bitcoin promotion because you dont need any knowledge for it despite the mythological fictional language that is easily adaptable and moldable into anything that suits the purpose of attracting new buyers. You are critical of bitcoin? "jeez guys, we are saying the same thing"!!! Whatever you say, the logical conclusion is to buy more bitcoin and if you want specific answers on questions they can not answer you will only receive further fiction and distraction. It is what it is and I dont know when this will stop.

45 minutes ago, rkbabang said:

Yes.  If I can't plug it into some formula I learned in school then I can't value it so it's valueless.   What also limits the ability to value it is that it is a one off, like the Picasso (this statement will be misinterpreted in a few minutes I'm sure).   There are no comparables.   There is no other crypto that is comparable to Bitcoin.  Eventually there will be a way to value it that will be thought in schools and then it will be ok.   But it will also be far more stable and probably only rise (or fall) in purchasing power every year around the rate of the growth in the world's economy.  It will eventually be a stable store of value, indeed the very measure of value, but when that happens the time to make a fortune from it will be long past.

 

If you mean this then you have no idea about how economics and currencies work and why those cases will never happen. You CAN NOT run state-capitalism with a currency that is limited in supply and with 0 control on that currency. I have already given multiple reasons why, you are using science-fiction language that sounds good to the average joe investor but from an economist perspective bitcoin is terrible to adopt as a currency for any national economy.

Edited November 12 by Luke

[Luke]

@John Hjorth By saying "its on me not you" that you dont understand bitcoin is unfortunately something many people say who do not invest in bitcoin and i think its very dangerous to say what you say. It gives possible buyers the delusion that bitcoin buyers are more intelligent than they are because its hard to understand (it is not).

 

Its not hard to understand, its bullshit. Thats what it is. Speak out when somebody speaks bullshit and dont say "i dont understand it so thats my problem"

[Luke]

Anyways, discussing why crypto is not logical with Bitcoin holders is the same as discussing why Jehovah Witnesses are in the wrong or why Scientologists are. The group think is too strong, the incentives too strong, its too complex of a topic to pin arguments down etc.

 

We should pass on and accept it for what it is. The last few pages show the conflict and arguments very well.

[Buckeye]

Hey Luke,

 

Thanks for your message. And you are totally correct. Not sure why I woke up so grumpy about this but at the end of the day, in my opinion, anyone who holds Bitcoin, and then discusses it with other people, are a paid spokesperson for Bitcoin. And those people are either two stupid to recognize it or too dishonest or deceitful to admit it. It’s maddening and they deserve to be called out for it. 
 

and then they try to say it’s the same thing as someone like Viking pounding the table on FRFHF. These idiots.

 

ha, hope you have a great day! 

[rkbabang]

14 minutes ago, Luke said:

You CAN NOT run state-capitalism with a currency that is limited in supply and with 0 control on that currency.

 

YES!   You are 100% correct.  I couldn't agree more. I think the days of crony-capitalism/state-capitalism/corporatism are numbered.  There's another term for a system that has "private property and the profit motive as legitimate incentives for productivity—provided that they did not conflict with the interests of the state."  Free markets are not state-capitalism/government controlled markets.

[Intelligent_Investor]

Bitcoin is worthless, I can't eat bitcoin, I can't live in bitcoin, and I can't buy anything with bitcoin unless I am on the black market. The only way I can get cash for bitcoin is to hope someone pays me more than how much I paid for bitcoin and that the exchanges aren't scams like FTX. The exact same arguments used to ascribe value to bitcoin were used to ascribe value to tulip bulbs.

[gfp]

1 minute ago, Intelligent_Investor said:

Bitcoin is worthless, I can't eat bitcoin, I can't live in bitcoin, and I can't buy anything with bitcoin unless I am on the black market. The only way I can get cash for bitcoin is to hope someone pays me more than how much I paid for bitcoin and that the exchanges aren't scams like FTX. The exact same arguments used to ascribe value to bitcoin were used to ascribe value to tulip bulbs.

 

I heard it's super easy to exchange bitcoin for cash

[Blake Hampton]

[Intelligent_Investor]

2 minutes ago, gfp said:

 

I heard it's super easy to exchange bitcoin for cash

On an exchange that is most likely a scam like ftx, and most aren't regulated either...other way is p2p but that relies on mutual trust that the counterparty isn't just gonna run and not pay you once you send the BTC to their wallet. Anyways if I wanted a digital currency I have something known as the US Dollar that is available in digital format