MMM20 Posted May 6 Posted May 6 (edited) Value it on normalized investment returns and combined ratio and with this amount of the best kind of leverage, a big structural advantage that somehow remains overlooked, it's easy to see how the long term CAGR could easily continue to be in the ~20% range, especially if Mr Market ever slides them into the "great capital allocator" / "compounder bro" bucket at some point in the future. We're talking about a ~10% earnings yield, almost all of which is distributable for buybacks at a discount. And those earnings should grow at double digit rates for a long time. How many opportunities like that exist in "big cap, outstanding track record, long runway" land nowadays? Sure, odds are the various drivers will have a down period at the same time at some point, but maybe our only edge as non-pod investors is the ability and duration to focus on the structural advantages because we can accept and live with that cyclicality and volatility - and maybe even take advantage of it because we don’t have risk managers or LPs looking over our shoulders every month (or day). Of course, that doesn’t mean there aren’t better ideas out there! I think I've got a few too! Edited May 6 by MMM20 1
Txvestor Posted May 6 Posted May 6 On 5/5/2026 at 12:52 PM, kab60 said: The industry has been in a hard mkt since like 2018. A very hard one last 5 years, which is the period everyone seems to cite as evidence their operations have improved. I won't repeat the same point, but it is a very cyclical industry. I would encourage users to read commentary from the brokers A fair point. However changes within their insurance segments over the past decade deserve some qualitative analysis as well. Insurance markets done harden or soften homogeneously. 1) They are much more internationally diversified. 20% of their underwritten premiums being outside of their transitional markets now according to the last Q call. 2) I believe they have also gone into more lines of insurance beyond traditional P&C. Workman's comp being one that comes to mind. Zenith is actually appears to be entering a hardening cycle for example. 3) They are able to keep more net written premiums and develop other cross synergies due to their global scale and depth, something which was less possible 10yrs ago. 4) Allied world which is a quality insurer that was added in the last decade and that added about 40% to their underwritten premiums, arguably skewing them to the better. 5) Last but certainly not least, the Barnard/Young effect. Where an executive with a wealth of industry experience worked to improve their operations across the board. I don't think that all of these factors can be ignored as having had some positive impact on insurance operations. If anything I'm glad we will be getting a softening cycle to test the impact of these items. They're a top 20 global insurer and they need to be able to compete with the big boys. We will know in a few years whether this is right or not. I'm in the camp that they are a better insurance operator today. Top half and possibly even top quartile.
mananainvesting Posted May 6 Posted May 6 Francis Chou video at the recent Value Investing Conference. The 1:29 mark, he expands on the float/equity ratio!!
djokovic1 Posted May 6 Posted May 6 (edited) Wow Francis is amazing! Thanks for sharing @mananainvesting. My sense is his not as famous as he should be outside of Fairfax community and Canada? Does anyone have his track record? Love the aspect he raises re. Investement leverage being high 2.5x-3x is super powerful which is what we have at Fairfax. To be fair a lot of other insurers also have high investment leverage (2.5x-3x) but none of them have i) A large allocation to equities like fairfax ii) a lot of the investing is outsourced (i.e more fees) Edited May 6 by djokovic1 1
Mystery Guest Posted May 6 Posted May 6 (edited) 3 hours ago, mananainvesting said: Francis Chou video at the recent Value Investing Conference. The 1:29 mark, he expands on the float/equity ratio!! Spoke to him at the AGM, told him I liked the presertation, he proceeded to quiz me on the content. I hope I answered correctly! Edited May 6 by Mystery Guest
mananainvesting Posted May 6 Posted May 6 20 minutes ago, Mystery Guest said: Spoke to him at the AGM, told him I liked the presertation, he proceeded to quiz me on the content. I hope I answered correctly! Haha! Epic!
Hoodlum Posted May 7 Posted May 7 It looks like Fairfax has made progress with the EuroLife sale, but is this now closing in Q3? Fairfax may need to acquire the Allied minority interest from OMERS without these funds, as the option to purchase the Allied shares expires in August. https://www.eurobank.gr/en/group/grafeio-tupou/etairiki-anakoinosi-07-05-2026-i
Hoodlum Posted May 7 Posted May 7 Does anyone have access to the share buybacks in April? I presume most of the buying would have occurred before the earnings blackout.
SafetyinNumbers Posted May 8 Posted May 8 5 hours ago, Hoodlum said: Does anyone have access to the share buybacks in April? I presume most of the buying would have occurred before the earnings blackout. They haven’t filed yet. Probably tomorrow.
Viking Posted May 8 Posted May 8 Fairfax Financial: The Ugly Duckling of the Insurance Industry Introduction Hans Christian Andersen’s The Ugly Duckling is not really a story about transformation. The swan was never ugly — it was simply misunderstood. Placed among ducks, the swan looked awkward and out of place. The other animals judged it using the wrong framework. Because it did not behave like a duck, they assumed it was inferior. For decades, many investors have viewed Fairfax Financial the same way. The market has largely analyzed Fairfax as a traditional property & casualty insurer — focusing heavily on underwriting results, combined ratios, and conventional insurance valuation metrics. But Fairfax has never been a conventional P/C insurer. At its core, Fairfax is something different: a long-term capital compounder built on insurance float, decentralized operations, equity investing, and disciplined capital allocation. Because the market has often viewed Fairfax through the wrong lens, the company has frequently been misunderstood, underappreciated, and misvalued. And yet, as Fairfax continues to execute and deliver above-average returns, investors are increasingly being forced to reconsider what the company actually is. The “ugly duckling” may finally be recognized for what it truly is: a swan. The Market’s Core Mistake The market’s misunderstanding begins with a flawed assumption — that Fairfax is primarily an insurance company. Insurance is the foundation of the business. Float provides the fuel. But Fairfax’s long-term economics are driven by something much broader. Fairfax is better understood as a long-term capital compounder built on three interconnected components: A decentralized P/C insurance operation A large and flexible investment portfolio Disciplined capital allocation These components reinforce one another. Insurance operations generate float. Float provides investable capital. Investments and capital allocation determine how effectively that capital compounds over time. Traditional insurers primarily monetize underwriting. Fairfax monetizes capital allocation. That is a fundamentally different business model. Today, Fairfax manages an investment portfolio of roughly $76 billion, including approximately $50 billion in fixed income and $26 billion in equities and equity-related investments. This is where leverage becomes critically important. Insurance float allows Fairfax to control an investment portfolio far larger than shareholders’ equity alone would support. One of the best ways to understand this dynamic is to compare total investments to shareholders’ equity. For a well-run insurer, float functions as low-cost leverage. When combined with sound underwriting, equity investing, and disciplined capital allocation, the compounding effect can become extremely powerful. Importantly, Fairfax allocates meaningful capital to equities and equity-like investments — asset classes that historically have generated higher long-term returns than fixed income securities. Combined with insurance leverage, this creates the potential for above-average long-term returns. Capital Allocation Is the Key Variable The critical question is not simply how much float Fairfax has. The real question is: how effectively can management allocate that capital over long periods of time? That is the straw that stirs the total return drink. This is also where Fairfax increasingly distinguishes itself from traditional P/C insurers. Since roughly 2018, Fairfax’s capital allocation has arguably been best in class among its peer group. Management has more than doubled the size of its insurance business, improved underwriting profitability, benefited from rising interest rates, monetized and optimized the equity portfolio, repurchased undervalued shares, and built significant recurring investment income — all while maintaining substantial flexibility. The company’s earnings power today is dramatically stronger than it was five years ago. Importantly, this transformation was not accidental. It was the direct result of capital allocation decisions. Past performance is never perfect. But in capital allocation businesses, past performance matters enormously because it provides evidence of management skill, discipline, and decision-making ability across different environments. In many ways, Fairfax today resembles a younger Berkshire Hathaway. During the 1980s and 1990s, Berkshire compounded capital at exceptional rates despite prolonged soft insurance markets. Insurance provided the float — low-cost leverage that Buffett could allocate opportunistically across equities, acquisitions, and wholly owned businesses. The key insight is that Berkshire’s long-term returns were never driven solely by underwriting conditions. They were driven by capital allocation. Fairfax increasingly appears to operate from the same playbook. An important distinction needs to be made. Buffett is the GOAT. Fairfax is not Berkshire Hathaway, and it would be unrealistic to expect Fairfax to replicate Buffett’s stock-picking record from the 1980s and 1990s. However, Fairfax has proven to be a very capable capital allocator and equity investor. Importantly, Fairfax today also has materially more leverage to float than Berkshire had during that earlier period. The lesson is straightforward: a soft insurance market does not automatically prevent exceptional shareholder returns. It hurts traditional P/C insurers because underwriting margins compress. But for a company with a powerful investment engine and strong capital allocation, insurance still provides the leverage while investments drive the compounding. The Swan Emerges The most important development at Fairfax over the past five years has been the transformation in earnings power. Historically, Fairfax was often viewed as a company that under-earned relative to its asset base and intrinsic potential. That has now changed materially. Stronger underwriting results, higher investment income and disciplined capital allocation have combined to materially increase normalized earnings power. With roughly $50 billion invested in fixed income securities and a relatively short-duration bond portfolio, Fairfax has also benefited significantly from reinvesting at higher interest rates. At the same time, Fairfax’s equity and non-insurance investments continue to provide additional upside and embedded value that is often not fully reflected in reported earnings. In The Ugly Duckling, the swan does not suddenly become beautiful. Others simply begin to recognize what it was all along. Fairfax may now be approaching a similar moment. The company increasingly combines: A high-quality insurance platform Massive investable float Rising recurring investment income Strong equity exposure Disciplined capital allocation Opportunistic share repurchases Multiple long-term compounding engines These are not the characteristics of a traditional insurer. They are the characteristics of a long-term capital compounding machine. That is the swan. As Fairfax continues to execute, compound intrinsic value, and demonstrate its transformed earnings power, investors may eventually stop viewing the company as an awkward insurance stock and begin recognizing it for what it really is: A decentralized, long-duration capital compounding machine built on insurance float and disciplined capital allocation. Not an ugly duckling. A swan. ----------- How to Think About Fairfax and Its Transformation in Recent Years - The Ugly Duckling The Ugly Duckling by Hans Christian Andersen is a classic fairy tale about rejection, identity, resilience, and transformation. First published in 1843, the story follows a young bird born in a farmyard who looks different from the other ducklings around him. Larger, awkward, and unattractive in appearance, he is mocked and bullied by the other animals almost immediately after birth. Even his own family struggles to accept him. Everywhere he goes, he is treated as an outsider. Unable to endure the constant ridicule, the ugly duckling leaves the farmyard and wanders alone through the countryside searching for acceptance and belonging. Along the way he encounters harsh conditions, loneliness, hunger, danger, and repeated rejection. The seasons change as he survives a difficult autumn and a brutal winter. Despite his suffering, he continues moving forward. During his journey, the duckling occasionally sees beautiful swans flying overhead. He admires them deeply but believes he could never belong among such graceful creatures. They represent everything he is not — elegant, admired, and confident. When spring finally arrives, the duckling approaches the swans, expecting to be rejected once again. Instead, as he looks into the water, he discovers that he himself has transformed into a magnificent swan. He had never been an ugly duckling at all; he was simply a swan born into the wrong environment. The other swans welcome him warmly, and for the first time in his life he experiences acceptance and happiness. The story’s central message is that people who appear different, misunderstood, or undervalued may possess hidden beauty and potential that only become visible with time and maturity. It is also a story about perseverance, self-discovery, and ultimately finding one’s true identity and place in the world. The story of the Ugly Duckling explains Fairfax’s journey (and that of its investors) of the past 40 years. Importantly, for Fairfax (and its investors), spring has arrived. ----------- The Incredible Power of Berkshire Hathaway’s Business Model Berkshire Hathaway’s stock increased from ~$2,800 in 1987 to over $48,000 in 1997. Insurance markets were soft for many of these years.
Parsad Posted May 8 Posted May 8 12 minutes ago, Viking said: Fairfax Financial: The Ugly Duckling of the Insurance Industry Introduction Hans Christian Andersen’s The Ugly Duckling is not really a story about transformation. The swan was never ugly — it was simply misunderstood. Placed among ducks, the swan looked awkward and out of place. The other animals judged it using the wrong framework. Because it did not behave like a duck, they assumed it was inferior. For decades, many investors have viewed Fairfax Financial the same way. The market has largely analyzed Fairfax as a traditional property & casualty insurer — focusing heavily on underwriting results, combined ratios, and conventional insurance valuation metrics. But Fairfax has never been a conventional P/C insurer. At its core, Fairfax is something different: a long-term capital compounder built on insurance float, decentralized operations, equity investing, and disciplined capital allocation. Because the market has often viewed Fairfax through the wrong lens, the company has frequently been misunderstood, underappreciated, and misvalued. And yet, as Fairfax continues to execute and deliver above-average returns, investors are increasingly being forced to reconsider what the company actually is. The “ugly duckling” may finally be recognized for what it truly is: a swan. The Market’s Core Mistake The market’s misunderstanding begins with a flawed assumption — that Fairfax is primarily an insurance company. Insurance is the foundation of the business. Float provides the fuel. But Fairfax’s long-term economics are driven by something much broader. Fairfax is better understood as a long-term capital compounder built on three interconnected components: A decentralized P/C insurance operation A large and flexible investment portfolio Disciplined capital allocation These components reinforce one another. Insurance operations generate float. Float provides investable capital. Investments and capital allocation determine how effectively that capital compounds over time. Traditional insurers primarily monetize underwriting. Fairfax monetizes capital allocation. That is a fundamentally different business model. Today, Fairfax manages an investment portfolio of roughly $76 billion, including approximately $50 billion in fixed income and $26 billion in equities and equity-related investments. This is where leverage becomes critically important. Insurance float allows Fairfax to control an investment portfolio far larger than shareholders’ equity alone would support. One of the best ways to understand this dynamic is to compare total investments to shareholders’ equity. For a well-run insurer, float functions as low-cost leverage. When combined with sound underwriting, equity investing, and disciplined capital allocation, the compounding effect can become extremely powerful. Importantly, Fairfax allocates meaningful capital to equities and equity-like investments — asset classes that historically have generated higher long-term returns than fixed income securities. Combined with insurance leverage, this creates the potential for above-average long-term returns. Capital Allocation Is the Key Variable The critical question is not simply how much float Fairfax has. The real question is: how effectively can management allocate that capital over long periods of time? That is the straw that stirs the total return drink. This is also where Fairfax increasingly distinguishes itself from traditional P/C insurers. Since roughly 2018, Fairfax’s capital allocation has arguably been best in class among its peer group. Management has more than doubled the size of its insurance business, improved underwriting profitability, benefited from rising interest rates, monetized and optimized the equity portfolio, repurchased undervalued shares, and built significant recurring investment income — all while maintaining substantial flexibility. The company’s earnings power today is dramatically stronger than it was five years ago. Importantly, this transformation was not accidental. It was the direct result of capital allocation decisions. Past performance is never perfect. But in capital allocation businesses, past performance matters enormously because it provides evidence of management skill, discipline, and decision-making ability across different environments. In many ways, Fairfax today resembles a younger Berkshire Hathaway. During the 1980s and 1990s, Berkshire compounded capital at exceptional rates despite prolonged soft insurance markets. Insurance provided the float — low-cost leverage that Buffett could allocate opportunistically across equities, acquisitions, and wholly owned businesses. The key insight is that Berkshire’s long-term returns were never driven solely by underwriting conditions. They were driven by capital allocation. Fairfax increasingly appears to operate from the same playbook. An important distinction needs to be made. Buffett is the GOAT. Fairfax is not Berkshire Hathaway, and it would be unrealistic to expect Fairfax to replicate Buffett’s stock-picking record from the 1980s and 1990s. However, Fairfax has proven to be a very capable capital allocator and equity investor. Importantly, Fairfax today also has materially more leverage to float than Berkshire had during that earlier period. The lesson is straightforward: a soft insurance market does not automatically prevent exceptional shareholder returns. It hurts traditional P/C insurers because underwriting margins compress. But for a company with a powerful investment engine and strong capital allocation, insurance still provides the leverage while investments drive the compounding. The Swan Emerges The most important development at Fairfax over the past five years has been the transformation in earnings power. Historically, Fairfax was often viewed as a company that under-earned relative to its asset base and intrinsic potential. That has now changed materially. Stronger underwriting results, higher investment income and disciplined capital allocation have combined to materially increase normalized earnings power. With roughly $50 billion invested in fixed income securities and a relatively short-duration bond portfolio, Fairfax has also benefited significantly from reinvesting at higher interest rates. At the same time, Fairfax’s equity and non-insurance investments continue to provide additional upside and embedded value that is often not fully reflected in reported earnings. In The Ugly Duckling, the swan does not suddenly become beautiful. Others simply begin to recognize what it was all along. Fairfax may now be approaching a similar moment. The company increasingly combines: A high-quality insurance platform Massive investable float Rising recurring investment income Strong equity exposure Disciplined capital allocation Opportunistic share repurchases Multiple long-term compounding engines These are not the characteristics of a traditional insurer. They are the characteristics of a long-term capital compounding machine. That is the swan. As Fairfax continues to execute, compound intrinsic value, and demonstrate its transformed earnings power, investors may eventually stop viewing the company as an awkward insurance stock and begin recognizing it for what it really is: A decentralized, long-duration capital compounding machine built on insurance float and disciplined capital allocation. Not an ugly duckling. A swan. ----------- How to Think About Fairfax and Its Transformation in Recent Years - The Ugly Duckling The Ugly Duckling by Hans Christian Andersen is a classic fairy tale about rejection, identity, resilience, and transformation. First published in 1843, the story follows a young bird born in a farmyard who looks different from the other ducklings around him. Larger, awkward, and unattractive in appearance, he is mocked and bullied by the other animals almost immediately after birth. Even his own family struggles to accept him. Everywhere he goes, he is treated as an outsider. Unable to endure the constant ridicule, the ugly duckling leaves the farmyard and wanders alone through the countryside searching for acceptance and belonging. Along the way he encounters harsh conditions, loneliness, hunger, danger, and repeated rejection. The seasons change as he survives a difficult autumn and a brutal winter. Despite his suffering, he continues moving forward. During his journey, the duckling occasionally sees beautiful swans flying overhead. He admires them deeply but believes he could never belong among such graceful creatures. They represent everything he is not — elegant, admired, and confident. When spring finally arrives, the duckling approaches the swans, expecting to be rejected once again. Instead, as he looks into the water, he discovers that he himself has transformed into a magnificent swan. He had never been an ugly duckling at all; he was simply a swan born into the wrong environment. The other swans welcome him warmly, and for the first time in his life he experiences acceptance and happiness. The story’s central message is that people who appear different, misunderstood, or undervalued may possess hidden beauty and potential that only become visible with time and maturity. It is also a story about perseverance, self-discovery, and ultimately finding one’s true identity and place in the world. The story of the Ugly Duckling explains Fairfax’s journey (and that of its investors) of the past 40 years. Importantly, for Fairfax (and its investors), spring has arrived. ----------- The Incredible Power of Berkshire Hathaway’s Business Model Berkshire Hathaway’s stock increased from ~$2,800 in 1987 to over $48,000 in 1997. Insurance markets were soft for many of these years. Nice post! I hope you are right about this Ugly Duckling following Berkshire's 1987-1997 trend! Also, when you read bedtime stories to your grand-kids, they probably will prefer the original, even though their RESP's might benefit handsomely from the new version! Cheers!
Parsad Posted May 8 Posted May 8 1 minute ago, Parsad said: Nice post! I hope you are right about this Ugly Duckling following Berkshire's 1987-1997 trend! Also, when you read bedtime stories to your grand-kids, they probably will prefer the original, even though their RESP's might benefit handsomely from the new version! Cheers! Also, that's a nearly 33% CAGR...hope Prem can do that! I've done that for six and a half years so far...so with the leverage at Fairfax and the right opportunity, it certainly is possible with all the talent there! Even $17,000 or 20% CAGR would be very nice. Cheers!
Viking Posted May 8 Posted May 8 (edited) 22 minutes ago, Parsad said: Nice post! I hope you are right about this Ugly Duckling following Berkshire's 1987-1997 trend! Also, when you read bedtime stories to your grand-kids, they probably will prefer the original, even though their RESP's might benefit handsomely from the new version! Cheers! Back in the 1990's I understood many of Buffett's / Berkshire Hathaway's strengths. What I did not understand was the power of time and compounding. I think this is the same challenge most investors/analysts have with Fairfax today. They are so focussed on trying to predict the next quarter or year that they are missing the bigger picture (what time and compounding will do). For a company with Fairfax's business model (capital allocation), trying to predict what happens the next quarter or even the next year is like a dog chasing its tail... (it is fun to guess...). In terms of rate of return, I am pretty confident Fairfax will be able to compound at an above average rate of return. Over a decade that would deliver an exceptional result. Now if they do even better (which certainly is possible given their exceptional track record over the past 7 years), well... that would be icing on the cake. The best part? Where the stock is priced today, investors expect Fairfax to compound at below average rates of return moving forward. As a result, there is a big margin of safety built into the stock price (at $1,622). Edited May 8 by Viking
Parsad Posted May 8 Posted May 8 33 minutes ago, Viking said: Back in the 1990's I understood many of Buffett's / Berkshire Hathaway's strengths. What I did not understand was the power of time and compounding. I think this is the same challenge most investors/analysts have with Fairfax today. They are so focussed on trying to predict the next quarter or year that they are missing the bigger picture (what time and compounding will do). For a company with Fairfax's business model (capital allocation), trying to predict what happens the next quarter or even the next year is like a dog chasing its tail... (it is fun to guess...). In terms of rate of return, I am pretty confident Fairfax will be able to compound at an above average rate of return. Over a decade that would deliver an exceptional result. Now if they do even better (which certainly is possible given their exceptional track record over the past 7 years), well... that would be icing on the cake. The best part? Where the stock is priced today, investors expect Fairfax to compound at below average rates of return moving forward. As a result, there is a big margin of safety built into the stock price (at $1,622). I read the above just before I read this article this morning: https://finance.yahoo.com/markets/stocks/articles/excellence-nothing-usher-says-holding-010123527.html So Dan Gilbert bought the Cavaliers for $375M...Usher's stake was estimated to be $9M or 2.4% of the team. At a $4.8B valuation, Usher's stake would have sold for $115M 20 years later. Not bad when you look at the size of the numbers...but that works out to only a 13.5% CAGR. Now imagine if their investment did what Fairfax aims for...15% CAGR...Usher's stake would have been closer to $150M. Yet, so many people will look at a gift horse in the mouth like Fairfax and admire/dream of owning a stake in the Cavaliers instead! Bizarre! Cheers!
Eldad Posted May 8 Posted May 8 2 hours ago, Viking said: Fairfax Financial: The Ugly Duckling of the Insurance Industry Introduction Hans Christian Andersen’s The Ugly Duckling is not really a story about transformation. The swan was never ugly — it was simply misunderstood. Placed among ducks, the swan looked awkward and out of place. The other animals judged it using the wrong framework. Because it did not behave like a duck, they assumed it was inferior. For decades, many investors have viewed Fairfax Financial the same way. The market has largely analyzed Fairfax as a traditional property & casualty insurer — focusing heavily on underwriting results, combined ratios, and conventional insurance valuation metrics. But Fairfax has never been a conventional P/C insurer. At its core, Fairfax is something different: a long-term capital compounder built on insurance float, decentralized operations, equity investing, and disciplined capital allocation. Because the market has often viewed Fairfax through the wrong lens, the company has frequently been misunderstood, underappreciated, and misvalued. And yet, as Fairfax continues to execute and deliver above-average returns, investors are increasingly being forced to reconsider what the company actually is. The “ugly duckling” may finally be recognized for what it truly is: a swan. The Market’s Core Mistake The market’s misunderstanding begins with a flawed assumption — that Fairfax is primarily an insurance company. Insurance is the foundation of the business. Float provides the fuel. But Fairfax’s long-term economics are driven by something much broader. Fairfax is better understood as a long-term capital compounder built on three interconnected components: A decentralized P/C insurance operation A large and flexible investment portfolio Disciplined capital allocation These components reinforce one another. Insurance operations generate float. Float provides investable capital. Investments and capital allocation determine how effectively that capital compounds over time. Traditional insurers primarily monetize underwriting. Fairfax monetizes capital allocation. That is a fundamentally different business model. Today, Fairfax manages an investment portfolio of roughly $76 billion, including approximately $50 billion in fixed income and $26 billion in equities and equity-related investments. This is where leverage becomes critically important. Insurance float allows Fairfax to control an investment portfolio far larger than shareholders’ equity alone would support. One of the best ways to understand this dynamic is to compare total investments to shareholders’ equity. For a well-run insurer, float functions as low-cost leverage. When combined with sound underwriting, equity investing, and disciplined capital allocation, the compounding effect can become extremely powerful. Importantly, Fairfax allocates meaningful capital to equities and equity-like investments — asset classes that historically have generated higher long-term returns than fixed income securities. Combined with insurance leverage, this creates the potential for above-average long-term returns. Capital Allocation Is the Key Variable The critical question is not simply how much float Fairfax has. The real question is: how effectively can management allocate that capital over long periods of time? That is the straw that stirs the total return drink. This is also where Fairfax increasingly distinguishes itself from traditional P/C insurers. Since roughly 2018, Fairfax’s capital allocation has arguably been best in class among its peer group. Management has more than doubled the size of its insurance business, improved underwriting profitability, benefited from rising interest rates, monetized and optimized the equity portfolio, repurchased undervalued shares, and built significant recurring investment income — all while maintaining substantial flexibility. The company’s earnings power today is dramatically stronger than it was five years ago. Importantly, this transformation was not accidental. It was the direct result of capital allocation decisions. Past performance is never perfect. But in capital allocation businesses, past performance matters enormously because it provides evidence of management skill, discipline, and decision-making ability across different environments. In many ways, Fairfax today resembles a younger Berkshire Hathaway. During the 1980s and 1990s, Berkshire compounded capital at exceptional rates despite prolonged soft insurance markets. Insurance provided the float — low-cost leverage that Buffett could allocate opportunistically across equities, acquisitions, and wholly owned businesses. The key insight is that Berkshire’s long-term returns were never driven solely by underwriting conditions. They were driven by capital allocation. Fairfax increasingly appears to operate from the same playbook. An important distinction needs to be made. Buffett is the GOAT. Fairfax is not Berkshire Hathaway, and it would be unrealistic to expect Fairfax to replicate Buffett’s stock-picking record from the 1980s and 1990s. However, Fairfax has proven to be a very capable capital allocator and equity investor. Importantly, Fairfax today also has materially more leverage to float than Berkshire had during that earlier period. The lesson is straightforward: a soft insurance market does not automatically prevent exceptional shareholder returns. It hurts traditional P/C insurers because underwriting margins compress. But for a company with a powerful investment engine and strong capital allocation, insurance still provides the leverage while investments drive the compounding. The Swan Emerges The most important development at Fairfax over the past five years has been the transformation in earnings power. Historically, Fairfax was often viewed as a company that under-earned relative to its asset base and intrinsic potential. That has now changed materially. Stronger underwriting results, higher investment income and disciplined capital allocation have combined to materially increase normalized earnings power. With roughly $50 billion invested in fixed income securities and a relatively short-duration bond portfolio, Fairfax has also benefited significantly from reinvesting at higher interest rates. At the same time, Fairfax’s equity and non-insurance investments continue to provide additional upside and embedded value that is often not fully reflected in reported earnings. In The Ugly Duckling, the swan does not suddenly become beautiful. Others simply begin to recognize what it was all along. Fairfax may now be approaching a similar moment. The company increasingly combines: A high-quality insurance platform Massive investable float Rising recurring investment income Strong equity exposure Disciplined capital allocation Opportunistic share repurchases Multiple long-term compounding engines These are not the characteristics of a traditional insurer. They are the characteristics of a long-term capital compounding machine. That is the swan. As Fairfax continues to execute, compound intrinsic value, and demonstrate its transformed earnings power, investors may eventually stop viewing the company as an awkward insurance stock and begin recognizing it for what it really is: A decentralized, long-duration capital compounding machine built on insurance float and disciplined capital allocation. Not an ugly duckling. A swan. ----------- How to Think About Fairfax and Its Transformation in Recent Years - The Ugly Duckling The Ugly Duckling by Hans Christian Andersen is a classic fairy tale about rejection, identity, resilience, and transformation. First published in 1843, the story follows a young bird born in a farmyard who looks different from the other ducklings around him. Larger, awkward, and unattractive in appearance, he is mocked and bullied by the other animals almost immediately after birth. Even his own family struggles to accept him. Everywhere he goes, he is treated as an outsider. Unable to endure the constant ridicule, the ugly duckling leaves the farmyard and wanders alone through the countryside searching for acceptance and belonging. Along the way he encounters harsh conditions, loneliness, hunger, danger, and repeated rejection. The seasons change as he survives a difficult autumn and a brutal winter. Despite his suffering, he continues moving forward. During his journey, the duckling occasionally sees beautiful swans flying overhead. He admires them deeply but believes he could never belong among such graceful creatures. They represent everything he is not — elegant, admired, and confident. When spring finally arrives, the duckling approaches the swans, expecting to be rejected once again. Instead, as he looks into the water, he discovers that he himself has transformed into a magnificent swan. He had never been an ugly duckling at all; he was simply a swan born into the wrong environment. The other swans welcome him warmly, and for the first time in his life he experiences acceptance and happiness. The story’s central message is that people who appear different, misunderstood, or undervalued may possess hidden beauty and potential that only become visible with time and maturity. It is also a story about perseverance, self-discovery, and ultimately finding one’s true identity and place in the world. The story of the Ugly Duckling explains Fairfax’s journey (and that of its investors) of the past 40 years. Importantly, for Fairfax (and its investors), spring has arrived. ----------- The Incredible Power of Berkshire Hathaway’s Business Model Berkshire Hathaway’s stock increased from ~$2,800 in 1987 to over $48,000 in 1997. Insurance markets were soft for many of these years. Good stuff. BRK put approximately 1/3 of shareholder equity into KO at the beginning of this period and then it went 15x by the end! No wonder he will never sell it.
Junior R Posted May 8 Posted May 8 (edited) 2 hours ago, Parsad said: I read the above just before I read this article this morning: https://finance.yahoo.com/markets/stocks/articles/excellence-nothing-usher-says-holding-010123527.html So Dan Gilbert bought the Cavaliers for $375M...Usher's stake was estimated to be $9M or 2.4% of the team. At a $4.8B valuation, Usher's stake would have sold for $115M 20 years later. Not bad when you look at the size of the numbers...but that works out to only a 13.5% CAGR. Now imagine if their investment did what Fairfax aims for...15% CAGR...Usher's stake would have been closer to $150M. Yet, so many people will look at a gift horse in the mouth like Fairfax and admire/dream of owning a stake in the Cavaliers instead! Bizarre! Cheers! I think problem one is FFH is to volatile for most...two in Canada people prefer dividend increases without realizing total return matters more....thats pretty much one of the reasons why IFC gets a higher P/B and higher P/E .. Edited May 8 by Junior R
Viking Posted May 8 Posted May 8 (edited) 47 minutes ago, Junior R said: I think problem one is FFH is to volatile for most...two in Canada people prefer dividend increases without realizing total return matters more....thats pretty much one of the reasons why IFC gets a higher P/B and higher P/E .. I am very interested to see what impact history has on investors perception of Fairfax in the coming years. Yes, 2010 to 2020 was largely a lost decade for shareholders. However, the past 5 years have been stellar. My guess is Fairfax will be able to compound BVPS at 15% (or more) each of the next 5 years (on average). Once we get to a 10 year track record that is outstanding does that impact the multiple that investors think the company is worth? As I have said in the past, I am an idiot when it comes to understanding how the market values Fairfax (the multiple at a given point in time). Edited May 8 by Viking
Junior R Posted May 8 Posted May 8 4 minutes ago, Viking said: I am very interested to see what impact history has on investors perception of Fairfax in the coming years. Yes, 2010 to 2020 was largely a lost decade for shareholders. However, the past 5 years have been stellar. My guess is Fairfax will be able to compound BVPS at 15% (or more) each of the next 5 years. Once we get to a 10 year track record that is outstanding does that impact the multiple that investors think the company is worth? As I have said in the past, I am an idiot when it comes to understanding how the market values Fairfax (the multiple at a given point in time). I think everything will be fine as BVPS increases 15% which is pretty much maybe 7% due to float ...it will get the appreciation it deserves...plus theres so many hidden gems that could easily sprout if US bonds go back down the loss on bonds reverse or if it comes time for maturity
Maverick47 Posted May 8 Posted May 8 18 minutes ago, Junior R said: I think everything will be fine as BVPS increases 15% which is pretty much maybe 7% due to float ...it will get the appreciation it deserves...plus theres so many hidden gems that could easily sprout One thing we will want to watch out for is the impact of large share repurchases at very modest positive multiples to BVPS…all else being equal, these can mask or modestly increase the likelihood that an increase of 15% per year or more in true intrinsic value per share ends up looking like an accounting CAGR of a bit less than 15% in reported BVPS. This is likely to be misunderstood by investors and may well contribute to an extended period of time where the company will be able to follow the Henry Singleton/Teledyne playbook and continue to produce stellar long term compounding effects for holders of the stock. The “ugly duckling” period of the stock in @Viking’s retelling of the Hans Christian Andersen story may well persist for some time yet. I am thankful for Danish writers, @John Hjorth!
73 Reds Posted May 8 Posted May 8 3 hours ago, Viking said: Back in the 1990's I understood many of Buffett's / Berkshire Hathaway's strengths. What I did not understand was the power of time and compounding. I think this is the same challenge most investors/analysts have with Fairfax today. They are so focussed on trying to predict the next quarter or year that they are missing the bigger picture (what time and compounding will do). For a company with Fairfax's business model (capital allocation), trying to predict what happens the next quarter or even the next year is like a dog chasing its tail... (it is fun to guess...). In terms of rate of return, I am pretty confident Fairfax will be able to compound at an above average rate of return. Over a decade that would deliver an exceptional result. Now if they do even better (which certainly is possible given their exceptional track record over the past 7 years), well... that would be icing on the cake. The best part? Where the stock is priced today, investors expect Fairfax to compound at below average rates of return moving forward. As a result, there is a big margin of safety built into the stock price (at $1,622). Completely agree. The only thing that may get shareholders in trouble is if they treat the stock like a trading vehicle. OTOH, when you consider the company's CAGR since inception and its present configuration, management and expectations, why would anyone want to sell their shares? As you suggest, the only reason even to look at the price is if you have available capital to acquire more. Otherwise, forget that you own a "stock" and consider your interest as a partnership in a well-run company.
Junior R Posted May 8 Posted May 8 12 minutes ago, 73 Reds said: Completely agree. The only thing that may get shareholders in trouble is if they treat the stock like a trading vehicle. OTOH, when you consider the company's CAGR since inception and its present configuration, management and expectations, why would anyone want to sell their shares? As you suggest, the only reason even to look at the price is if you have available capital to acquire more. Otherwise, forget that you own a "stock" and consider your interest as a partnership in a well-run company. +1
Gregmal Posted May 8 Posted May 8 (edited) 19 minutes ago, 73 Reds said: Completely agree. The only thing that may get shareholders in trouble is if they treat the stock like a trading vehicle. OTOH, when you consider the company's CAGR since inception and its present configuration, management and expectations, why would anyone want to sell their shares? As you suggest, the only reason even to look at the price is if you have available capital to acquire more. Otherwise, forget that you own a "stock" and consider your interest as a partnership in a well-run company. Uh-huh! I mean even recently, it's gotten a little out of hand with all the "why is Fairfax underperforming?" talk....LOL wut? Underperforming? What exactly is your timeline? Its kicked the living shit outta anything over the past 5 years. Heck, even if it didnt, the returns have been more than adequate, within pretty much any scope. But we want/need to "know" why it's "underperforming"???? And here I thought it was only dumb MEME stock traders that believed "stonks only go up!".. Edited May 8 by Gregmal
John Hjorth Posted May 8 Posted May 8 57 minutes ago, Maverick47 said: One thing we will want to watch out for is the impact of large share repurchases at very modest positive multiples to BVPS…all else being equal, these can mask or modestly increase the likelihood that an increase of 15% per year or more in true intrinsic value per share ends up looking like an accounting CAGR of a bit less than 15% in reported BVPS. This is likely to be misunderstood by investors and may well contribute to an extended period of time where the company will be able to follow the Henry Singleton/Teledyne playbook and continue to produce stellar long term compounding effects for holders of the stock. The “ugly duckling” period of the stock in @Viking’s retelling of the Hans Christian Andersen story may well persist for some time yet. I am thankful for Danish writers, @John Hjorth! This a great way to express it, @Maverick47!, - - - o 0 o - - - -That said, I have my Munich Re shares up for sale today [owned since August 16th 2013] , to buy more Fairfax next week.
Txvestor Posted May 8 Posted May 8 (edited) 2 hours ago, Viking said: I am very interested to see what impact history has on investors perception of Fairfax in the coming years. Yes, 2010 to 2020 was largely a lost decade for shareholders. However, the past 5 years have been stellar. My guess is Fairfax will be able to compound BVPS at 15% (or more) each of the next 5 years (on average). Once we get to a 10 year track record that is outstanding does that impact the multiple that investors think the company is worth? As I have said in the past, I am an idiot when it comes to understanding how the market values Fairfax (the multiple at a given point in time). As someone who first bought a small position in Fairfax in 2008 then increased it to a modest position by 2010/2011 and then suffered the decade of mediocrity, then gradually increased my position over the past 6yrs to where it is -at a 25% position today. I will say this, the market is likely adapting to the new Fairfax even slower than I did. Its not US listed, and doesn't make for a splashy visual in any portfolio, its just a more boring and in the markets eyes still very inconsistent compounder. Aside from that some of the insane and arguably not repeatable returns in tech, think NVDA APPL GOOG etc. make Fairfax look boring. However if you look at valuations vs available runway a different picture emerges. I truly believe the CDS windfall was part of the reason they did the equity and deflation hedges which along with low interest rates and poor equity selections lost them that decade of the 2010s. They are absolutely a much different company now in almost every measure. Better and equally importantly a bigger and more diversified insurance operation. Better likelihood of a period of higher interest rates. It doesn't seem too hard for me to pencil in a 5% return onto the bond portfolio. A 360* optionality of investments including private equity type, public equities, bonds, CRE backed investments, stock buybacks, minority interest buyouts, funding insurance subsidiary growth whereever it exists, venture capital incubation of start ups, Indian infrastructure build, and so on. Not too many investment managers have all that available. They can do any or none of them based on price and expected returns. Added to that is an approximate 3:1 leverage. Which means a 5% total portfolio return gives them the 15% ROE. Atleast pretax. And if you given them any credit whatsoever for the other value creation options above, that's easily your post tax return. I think they hit 7.7% last year. Thats the power of leverage and compounding combined together. Of course it works in both directions but when you see the risk controls they have, like the short term bond durations and maniacal emphasis on underwriting standards, diversification, limited public equities exposure, Cash and available credit line positions etc. There's reason to believe they constantly look at that aspect very closely. I don't have much concerns that they are set up for a 10-15% average compounding rate over the next decade. Thats a 3-4x and if they do that at some point a rerating of the valuation is also inevitable. Getting us to that 5x. It will for sure be interesting to see the evolution. If they give us a 5x return, it wouldn't surprise me if they did it with only a 2.5-3x bump in market cap either. And at that point if it plays out like that, you could imagine the value add of the current share buybacks. Edited May 8 by Txvestor
Crip1 Posted May 8 Posted May 8 Voting machine - Weighing machine A week ago is when earnings came out. It's hard to argue that FFH had a notably better Q1 earnings report than did FIH, yet FIH share price has outperformed per the first graphic below. Looking at the YTD comparison, again, the news out of FFH outside of the earnings report (Poseidon) has been notably better than FIH (Sanmar) but, again, not only has FIH share price outperformed, it's outperformed dramatically even accounting for the FFH dividend. Efficient markets? I don't believe so. -Crip
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