Political Posts

[Sweet]

22 minutes ago, Parsad said:

 

Agree!  Although, I'm not sure it is Bibi who doesn't want to go in...he just knows he can't do it alone.  Cheers!

Probably.  From Iran’s perspective, the Rubicon has been crossed.  They are directly striking Israel and Middle East countries, and the worst they are getting in return are air strikes which they can eat all day long.  Trump clearly wants a deal and doesn’t seem to want troops involved - but maybe his hand is forced.  In any case, hard to see how negotiations go anywhere here when it looks like Iran can just tolerate the bombs.

 

Edited yesterday at 08:03 AM by Sweet

[Spekulatius]

4 hours ago, Sweet said:

Iran war is a mess, despite any claims to the contrary, because Trump / Bibi aren’t willing to go in.  Iran can get bombed for years and it won’t make a jot of difference.  Major fumble.

Going in would be an even larger fumble. I think the casualty count would be very high and the war would take a long time and not end with a win.

[73 Reds]

46 minutes ago, Spekulatius said:

Going in would be an even larger fumble. I think the casualty count would be very high and the war would take a long time and not end with a win.

Sigh; we can't negotiate a win.  Even if we think we've won, the next fanatical leadership would void any such belief.  A win means the Iranian people decide for themselves.  The only way that is possible is through force and a belief by Iranians that they can assume responsibility of their Country without fear of retribution.  The rest is all talking points.

[cwericb]

When will the US ever learn that you can have the biggest navy, the fastest air force and the most well equipped  army in the world and still not be able to win a war?

 

It truly takes a special group of media star idiots to start a war with a third world country and arrogantly believe they can win it in days and yet months later be in a worse position then before they started. The middle east has been sucked in to a conflict they didn't want, the price of oil, LNG, fertilizer, etc has pushed the inflation rate past 4% - and counting - all because these brainless twits started a war that they are now desperately trying to convince the world they won.

[dealraker]

I think Trump gears others into fantasy.  What's the probability of this wild success in Iran, all the change hoped for?  

 

Of all people, what in the world makes us think of all people that Donald Trump can orchestrate anything like this?  Donald is always a net negative for others; he's always scrapes a paycheck for failed endeavors.  He's done it consistently for 55 years.

 

Trump is running away from accountability and he will succeed at this, he always does.  Do the rest of us gain from what he does?  There's increasingly more stuff that Don needs to distract us from.  His actions are going to be many, trivial, off topic, but all will gain huge media.

 

Trump looks increasingly unhealthy and frail.  My guess is this will orchestrate some crazy shit.  

 

 

[rogermunibond]

[cwericb]

6 minutes ago, rogermunibond said:

 The "great deal maker" couldn't properly order a taco at Taco Bell.  I bet he couldn't tell you if a taco was $5.00 or $500. No concept of the real world the rest of us live in.

[73 Reds]

23 minutes ago, dealraker said:

I think Trump gears others into fantasy.  What's the probability of this wild success in Iran, all the change hoped for?  

 

Of all people, what in the world makes us think of all people that Donald Trump can orchestrate anything like this?  Donald is always a net negative for others; he's always scrapes a paycheck for failed endeavors.  He's done it consistently for 55 years.

 

Trump is running away from accountability and he will succeed at this, he always does.  Do the rest of us gain from what he does?  There's increasingly more stuff that Don needs to distract us from.  His actions are going to be many, trivial, off topic, but all will gain huge media.

 

Trump looks increasingly unhealthy and frail.  My guess is this will orchestrate some crazy shit.  

 

 

Trump makes a win in Iran possible.  More than can be said for all of his predecessors.

[cubsfan]

I love hearing all the second guessing clowns cheer for Iran defeating Trump. The same group that day after day excoriated POTUS for not entering the Ukraine conflict to level Russia.

 

Only here on CoBF.

[dealraker]

15 minutes ago, 73 Reds said:

Trump makes a win in Iran possible.  More than can be said for all of his predecessors.

 

[dealraker]

8 minutes ago, dealraker said:

 

Those who like or use Trump for their gains whether real or not are going to claim massive success- total success- no matter the outcome.  This is the way it works.  So yes the win is possible; Trump always wins with some.

 

Given Trump's age and his short life span to come it won't be long until those proclaiming his success are invisible and ignored.   

 

New politicians are soon to rock the world of the US of A.  

Edited 21 hours ago by dealraker

[73 Reds]

Just now, dealraker said:

Those who like or use Trump for their gains whether real or not are going to claim massive success- total success- no matter the outcome.  This is the way it work.  So yes the win is possible; Trump always wins with some.

 

Given Trump's age and his short life span to come it won't be long until those proclaiming his success are invisible and ignored.   

 

New politicians are soon to rock the world of the US of A.  

Let's hope we get a batch of new politicians to replace the current crop.  Yet while taking a break from Trump-hate, why not acknowledge that Trump is responsible for The Abraham Accords which could potentially not only change the relationship of many of those countries with the US, they've curtailed Iranian support from those same countries which may be the deciding factor as to any permanent positive change that may come in Iran.

[cubsfan]

8 minutes ago, 73 Reds said:

Let's hope we get a batch of new politicians to replace the current crop.  Yet while taking a break from Trump-hate, why not acknowledge that Trump is responsible for The Abraham Accords which could potentially not only change the relationship of many of those countries with the US, they've curtailed Iranian support from those same countries which may be the deciding factor as to any permanent positive change that may come in Iran.

 

Some things are far too obvious for the Trump haters.  There is a very good chance that the entire Mid-East will change for years - for the good.

 

Not one nitwit acknowledges that the stunning realignment of Arab states with Israel, against Iran. 

Edited 21 hours ago by cubsfan

[73 Reds]

12 minutes ago, cubsfan said:

 

Some things are far too obvious for the Trump haters.  There is a very good chance that the entire Mid-East will change for years - for the good.

 

Not one nitwit acknowledges that the stunning realignment of Arab states with Israel, against Iran. 

For now; in the end Israel would be happy with mutual co-existence, like its relationship with Egypt and Jordan.  As long as there are no more wars or terrorist threats.  The problem with what we see here on this Board and in general is most people have never been to the region, don't understand the region and really have little or no interest in it at all.  Its easy to simply pile on Trump and push an ideology.

[changegonnacome]

1 hour ago, 73 Reds said:

The Abraham Accords which could potentially not only change the relationship of many of those countries with the US, they've curtailed Iranian support from those same countries which may be the deciding factor as to any permanent positive change that may come in Iran.

 

Thats a very rosy view of the outcome here.......Trump is a transactional guy with the time horizon of fruit fly......... he's not thinking in decades, why would he? you can't get praise six feet under!

 

Equally possible to your rosy outcome, indeed I think more likely (given Trump is going to bail soon)....is that Iran's standing in the Middle East has not been diminished, it's been greatly enhanced....they've proved irrefutably they can control the SOH, they've proved via their ballistic missile capability and drone tech that they can hit at will targets in the region while at the same time showing that they can sustain weeks of air assaults and according to US intelligence retain 80% of their missile & drone capability.

 

Do you think, for example, the GCC states that got hit during this are going to let the US rebuild our bases there? The same bases that became magnets for iran's attack when the war went down, the same bases that let Iran argue various countries we're aiding the US in their attacks and so those countries infrastructure became fair game or at a minimum collateral damage.

 

I dont know what will happen - but I can tell a story here, a very plausible one......about a region where the US's influence & military reach is greatly diminished, a GCC that is interested in diversify away from the US its various security relationships....to relationships that wont get them into trouble on the whim of a US Presidents that may become (like Donald) increasingly non-conventional and cavalier in foreign escapades while being too in hoc to the Israeli Prime Minister.....in that story Iran is not a diminished player in region post-Epic Fury, it's a greatly enhanced one in terms of strategic leverage.

 

Edited 20 hours ago by changegonnacome

[cubsfan]

Oh that's good one change.

 

Iran was never a threat.

 

Trump is a Bibi puppet.

 

Iran's power has been tremendously enhanced.

 

We need to rename thread "How Trump fried my brain"

[Sweet]

5 hours ago, Spekulatius said:

Going in would be an even larger fumble. I think the casualty count would be very high and the war would take a long time and not end with a win.

Possibly, but do you even have to go in?  Half a million troops at the Iraq border, demanding the uranium or else, I expect that helps resolve the situation one way or another.

 

 

2 hours ago, cubsfan said:

I love hearing all the second guessing clowns cheer for Iran defeating Trump. The same group that day after day excoriated POTUS for not entering the Ukraine conflict to level Russia.

 

Only here on CoBF.

I’m certainly not cheering but from Iran’s perspective what’s the incentive now to negotiate?  The regime itself has survived probably the worst, and they can wait longer than Trump can - especially if he loses the midterms.  The Iranians smell a bit of a bluff.

[73 Reds]

53 minutes ago, changegonnacome said:

 

Thats a very rosy view of the outcome here.......Trump is a transactional guy with the time horizon of fruit fly......... he's not thinking in decades, why would he? you can't get praise six feet under!

 

Equally possible to your rosy outcome, indeed I think more likely (given Trump is going to bail soon)....is that Iran's standing in the Middle East has not been diminished, it's been greatly enhanced....they've proved irrefutably they can control the SOH, they've proved via their ballistic missile capability and drone tech that they can hit at will targets in the region while at the same time showing that they can sustain weeks of air assaults and according to US intelligence retain 80% of their missile & drone capability.

 

Do you think, for example, the GCC states that got hit during this are going to let the US rebuild our bases there? The same bases that became magnets for iran's attack when the war went down, the same bases that let Iran argue various countries we're aiding the US in their attacks and so those countries infrastructure became fair game or at a minimum collateral damage.

 

I dont know what will happen - but I can tell a story here, a very plausible one......about a region where the US's influence & military reach is greatly diminished, a GCC that is interested in diversify away from the US its various security relationships....to relationships that wont get them into trouble on the whim of a US Presidents that may become (like Donald) increasingly non-conventional and cavalier in foreign escapades while being too in hoc to the Israeli Prime Minister.....in that story Iran is not a diminished player in region post-Epic Fury, it's a greatly enhanced one in terms of strategic leverage.

 

As I said, the outcome is "possible".  A far cry from any prior administration.  Of course it is "rosy".  But an effort is being made.  All I could ask for.

[changegonnacome]

9 minutes ago, 73 Reds said:

As I said, the outcome is "possible".  A far cry from any prior administration.  Of course it is "rosy".  But an effort is being made.  All I could ask for.

 

Yep totally get it. You voted for a President that would do stuff for a change, shake things up.....an action man......Iran may, in time, be the highest and best example that change does not equal improvement. Many times, as traditional conservatives know well, with change comes unintended consequences and not good ones. 

 

Trump & Bibi's attempt to 'change the game' in the M.E. - is starting to look like a huge strategic blunder......seems like the only thing that can actually save their asses and bail them out of this mess is ironically the Iranian people.

 

I'm with you - I hope we get the rosy outcome....on the evidence right now its tilting towards the blunder part of the ledger.

 

[cubsfan]

26 minutes ago, Sweet said:

I’m certainly not cheering but from Iran’s perspective what’s the incentive now to negotiate?  The regime itself has survived probably the worst, and they can wait longer than Trump can - especially if he loses the midterms.  The Iranians smell a bit of a bluff.

 

Understand your thinking. Exactly, what is getting out of the SOH?? Certainly no Iranian oil exports. Economic strangulation doesn't happen overnight.

 

The incumbent President rarely wins the midterms. Which makes it even more surprising that POTUS took this action. 

 

I think it's highly doubtful that Iran can outlast until 2029. I seriously doubt that the worst has come in regards to economic/military damage. It can get a lot worse for them.  

 

Trump trying to negotiate an end with no loss of life is quite admirable, even if it may be futile.

 

Bluffing? I think you are right - the IRGC thinks he is bluffing.

Edited 18 hours ago by cubsfan

[73 Reds]

18 minutes ago, changegonnacome said:

 

Yep totally get it. You voted for a President that would do stuff for a change, shake things up.....an action man......Iran may, in time, be the highest and best example that change does not equal improvement. Many times, as traditional conservatives know well, with change comes unintended consequences and not good ones. 

 

Trump & Bibi's attempt to 'change the game' in the M.E. - is starting to look like a huge strategic blunder......seems like the only thing that can actually save their asses and bail them out of this mess is ironically the Iranian people.

 

I'm with you - I hope we get the rosy outcome....on the evidence right now its tilting towards the blunder part of the ledger.

 

I know you get it and understand why the US and Israel are important strategic allies, something that eludes certain posters on this thread.  I'm not writing off Bibi or his aspirations just yet.  If they can be framed in a way that also is a boon for some of the other countries in the Middle East that understand the prospects of doing business with Israel and more so with the US, there is always the chance that they sign on.  

Edited 18 hours ago by 73 Reds
word

[changegonnacome]

16 minutes ago, 73 Reds said:

I'm not writing off Bibi or his aspirations just yet.

 

Whatever about his aspirations....I think Bibi has become a liability and I think Israel's national interests would be well served if the next coalition Government did not have him sitting on top.....I don't follow domestic Israeli politics closely any political figures (of the right) that could be a reasonable replacement? I get the sense that there isnt only because Bibi has been such looming large figure for decades...and no doubt has been clever enough not to let many flowers bloom beneath his feet!

[73 Reds]

1 minute ago, changegonnacome said:

 

Whatever about his aspirations....I think Bibi has become a liability and I think Israel's national interests would be well served if the next coalition Government did not have him sitting on top.....I don't follow domestic Israeli politics closely any political figures (of the right) that could be a reasonable replacement? I get the sense that there isnt only because Bibi has been such looming large figure for decades...and no doubt has been clever enough not to let many flowers bloom beneath his feet!

Oh, he's clearly a poster child for the word "politician".  Yet he is precisely what Israel needed in the wake of October 7 and probably garners more widespread support in Israel than what any polls may suggest (I know many, many who quietly support him).  Whether he succeeds in his stated goal of regime change in Iran all depends on something we talk about often here on COBF - an inflection point.  That being a time when the Iranian people believe the reward of rising up against the ruling regime is worth the risk.  Israel would like to do all it can to further this along even if it sometimes gets Bibi entangled with US politics and even Trump, though any real disagreements between them are so obviously creations of a MSM and left wing politicians.  With all the obstacles standing in the way of success, its truly amazing we've made it even this far.

[ourkid8]

8 hours ago, 73 Reds said:

Oh, he's clearly a poster child for the word "politician".  Yet he is precisely what Israel needed in the wake of October 7 and probably garners more widespread support in Israel than what any polls may suggest (I know many, many who quietly support him).  Whether he succeeds in his stated goal of regime change in Iran all depends on something we talk about often here on COBF - an inflection point.  That being a time when the Iranian people believe the reward of rising up against the ruling regime is worth the risk.  Israel would like to do all it can to further this along even if it sometimes gets Bibi entangled with US politics and even Trump, though any real disagreements between them are so obviously creations of a MSM and left wing politicians.  With all the obstacles standing in the way of success, its truly amazing we've made it even this far.

 

I nearly spat out my coffee reading your passionate takedown of regime change talk. Sure, maybe Trump is a buffoon for entertaining the idea, but funny enough, all U.S. intelligence agencies also rejected the notion that a few strikes or even boots on the ground would magically trigger regime collapse.

 

In response, Iran launched its big volunteer drive, asking for about a million volunteers to die for the Supreme Leader. And lo and behold, 14 million signed up (with the president being #1 in line and I would do the same)  Truly inspiring turnout.
 

Please stop with your ethno-supremacy nonsense. The world has had enough. 

Edited 10 hours ago by ourkid8