Liberty Posted May 5, 2020 Share Posted May 5, 2020 It's not "another week or two" whether we have lock-downs or not. It's likely another 6-10 months if not longer. I don't think SK or NZ will have 6-10 months of lockdown. They might bounce back and forth between tighter and looser measures, but places that did this well (lockdown to crush the initial curve + masks + massive testing + contact tracing) are in much better shape. Sure. I was talking mostly US and somewhat Europe. Places that have close to zero cases + test/trace/etc probably will do fine without lock downs. And definitely will do better without lock downs than places that still have tons of cases and don't test/trace. Yeah, meanwhile in the US.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Viking Posted May 5, 2020 Share Posted May 5, 2020 About that reopening https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-usa-texas/texas-back-in-business-barely-yall-as-malls-restaurants-empty-idUSKBN22H19K The problem is as follows: if mall/whatever reopened, I would go there if I knew I'd be the only person in the mall. But then store(s) don't get enough business. OTOH, if everyone rushes in, then I wouldn't go there. So likely you can't get many people there. It's also possible that there will be a bad feedback loop: people don't go to malls, cases don't rise, people think that it's safe and go to malls, then cases rise again, rinse, repeat? Restaurants are more complicated than stores. Even if I'm the only customer there, there is a risk of getting infected from the staff. More risk than if I ordered for delivery. So screw going to restaurant. What this speaks to is the importance of the response from the government, at all three levels: if people have confidence in Federal, State and Local governments and trusts what they are saying and doing regarding the virus then phase 2 (post lockdown) will go better (keep case count low and maximize economic activity). Lots of learnings to come. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liberty Posted May 5, 2020 Share Posted May 5, 2020 https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1257741326650470400?s=20 Well run States should not be bailing out poorly run States, using CoronaVirus as the excuse! The elimination of Sanctuary Cities, Payroll Taxes, and perhaps Capital Gains Taxes, must be put on the table. Also lawsuit indemnification & business deductions for restaurants & ent. How to politicize a pandemic and basically blackmail people in doing your pet wishes while witholding the help that they need and deserve by being, y'know, part of the country. What he calls bailouts are actually just being a single country. When New Orleans or Mississippi or Florida gets hit by a huge hurricane and they get help, are they getting "bailed out" by the other states or is helping the worst hit places just the function of a government? The most urban states are worse hit first by pandemics, that's biology, but he's claiming this is some kind of political thing to punish enemies. How sociopathic do you have to be as people are suffering and dying? Don't the urban coastal states pay a lot more to the federal government than many of the poorer states that aren't too badly hit yet? So they are supposed to pay more and get less in return? When he bailed out farmers when his tarrifs hurt them, that was fine because it was political allies, right? Is he trying to break up the United States? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liberty Posted May 5, 2020 Share Posted May 5, 2020 Oh, and he's thinking about phasing out the coronavirus task force... https://www.cnbc.com/2020/05/05/white-house-considers-phasing-out-coronavirus-task-force-source-says.html If you declare victory and ignore the virus, it'll probably go away before the election, must be the thinking. Not like we have to stay on top of this thing like a hawk to have any chance of getting the best outcome possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ERICOPOLY Posted May 5, 2020 Share Posted May 5, 2020 https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1257741326650470400?s=20 Well run States should not be bailing out poorly run States, using CoronaVirus as the excuse! The elimination of Sanctuary Cities, Payroll Taxes, and perhaps Capital Gains Taxes, must be put on the table. Also lawsuit indemnification & business deductions for restaurants & ent. How to politicize a pandemic and basically blackmail people in doing your pet wishes while witholding the help that they need and deserve by being, y'know, part of the country. What he calls bailouts are actually just being a single country. When New Orleans or Mississippi or Florida gets hit by a huge hurricane and they get help, are they getting "bailed out" by the other states or is helping the worst hit places just the function of a government? The most urban states are worse hit first by pandemics, that's biology, but he's claiming this is some kind of political thing to punish enemies. How sociopathic do you have to be as people are suffering and dying? Don't the urban coastal states pay a lot more to the federal government than many of the poorer states that aren't too badly hit yet? So they are supposed to pay more and get less in return? When he bailed out farmers when his tarrifs hurt them, that was fine because it was political allies, right? Is he trying to break up the United States? He must have read the weekend's headlines about his party deserting him, so he's showing support for eliminating cap gains, expanding business deduction limits, and cutting payroll taxes. And he's using coronavirus as the excuse to cover his tracks of obviously buying votes here, and covering his tracks of using that excuse by first accusing Democrats of using Coronavirus as an excuse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurgis Posted May 5, 2020 Share Posted May 5, 2020 About that reopening https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-usa-texas/texas-back-in-business-barely-yall-as-malls-restaurants-empty-idUSKBN22H19K The problem is as follows: if mall/whatever reopened, I would go there if I knew I'd be the only person in the mall. But then store(s) don't get enough business. OTOH, if everyone rushes in, then I wouldn't go there. So likely you can't get many people there. It's also possible that there will be a bad feedback loop: people don't go to malls, cases don't rise, people think that it's safe and go to malls, then cases rise again, rinse, repeat? Restaurants are more complicated than stores. Even if I'm the only customer there, there is a risk of getting infected from the staff. More risk than if I ordered for delivery. So screw going to restaurant. Most people can’t conceptualize risk from something not visible, so they will conclude that Malls are save, because other people go there, which ironically makes them less safe. Agreed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurgis Posted May 5, 2020 Share Posted May 5, 2020 It's not "another week or two" whether we have lock-downs or not. It's likely another 6-10 months if not longer. I don't think SK or NZ will have 6-10 months of lockdown. They might bounce back and forth between tighter and looser measures, but places that did this well (lockdown to crush the initial curve + masks + massive testing + contact tracing) are in much better shape. Sure. I was talking mostly US and somewhat Europe. Places that have close to zero cases + test/trace/etc probably will do fine without lock downs. And definitely will do better without lock downs than places that still have tons of cases and don't test/trace. Yeah, meanwhile in the US.. "Your honor, my client was exercising her 2nd amendment rights to kill the virus that was sitting on the guard's head". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurgis Posted May 5, 2020 Share Posted May 5, 2020 https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1257741326650470400?s=20 Well run States should not be bailing out poorly run States, using CoronaVirus as the excuse! The elimination of Sanctuary Cities, Payroll Taxes, and perhaps Capital Gains Taxes, must be put on the table. Also lawsuit indemnification & business deductions for restaurants & ent. How to politicize a pandemic and basically blackmail people in doing your pet wishes while witholding the help that they need and deserve by being, y'know, part of the country. What he calls bailouts are actually just being a single country. When New Orleans or Mississippi or Florida gets hit by a huge hurricane and they get help, are they getting "bailed out" by the other states or is helping the worst hit places just the function of a government? The most urban states are worse hit first by pandemics, that's biology, but he's claiming this is some kind of political thing to punish enemies. How sociopathic do you have to be as people are suffering and dying? Don't the urban coastal states pay a lot more to the federal government than many of the poorer states that aren't too badly hit yet? So they are supposed to pay more and get less in return? When he bailed out farmers when his tarrifs hurt them, that was fine because it was political allies, right? Is he trying to break up the United States? Hey, we are really glad Kim Jong Un is alive and well! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
watsa_is_a_randian_hero Posted May 5, 2020 Share Posted May 5, 2020 Trump brags about doing things that are consensual. Trump has never bragged about assault. The women disagree with you that it was consensual, including the 13 yr old girl that Trump allegedly raped in Jeffery Epstein's apartment: The number of women who have accused Trump of rape or sexual assault is at least 12 https://www.mic.com/articles/156669/how-many-women-have-accused-donald-trump-of-rape-or-sexual-assault#.KujVwb2jl I could pay someone to accuse you of raping them when they were 12...that doesn't mean that it happened. Trump is not epstein or weinstein or cosby...there is nothing credible or convicted (or even prosecuted). Again, you can't say "____ brags about assaulting women" when assault is a crime he has never been convicted of (or even prosecuted for). He bragged about getting women because of fame and money - you have to be really ignorant to be oblivious to this. Anyone who says that just sounds jealous that he gets laid because he has fame and money (and you don't, so you feel some need to take him down). To really hammer the point home about how ludicrous the idea is, envision you are trump and have his personality. Think long and hard about it, and the ego. Do you really think someone like that would say they need to assault a women to get laid? This would be a total contradiction to the personality. Requiring assault to get laid is an admission you couldn't do it on your own...this is a total contradiction to Trumps talk-track...he would never "brag about assaulting women". He would brag about getting laid (consensually) because of who he is (fame/wealth/personality)...those who don't see this are failing an iq test or just simply blinded by jealousy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liberty Posted May 5, 2020 Share Posted May 5, 2020 The coronavirus response being spearheaded by President Trump’s son-in-law, Jared Kushner, has relied in part on volunteers from consulting and private equity firms with little expertise in the tasks to which they were assigned, exacerbating chronic problems in obtaining supplies for hospitals and other needs, according to numerous government officials and a volunteer involved in the effort. The document alleges that the team responsible for PPE had little success in helping the government secure such equipment, in part because none of the team’s members had significant experience in health care, procurement or supply-chain operations. In addition, none of the volunteers had existing relationships with manufacturers or a clear understanding of customs requirements or Food and Drug Administration rules, according to the complaint and two senior administration officials. https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/kushner-coronavirus-effort-said-to-be-hampered-by-inexperienced-volunteers/2020/05/05/6166ef0c-8e1c-11ea-9e23-6914ee410a5f_story.html I guess that's partly why Trump makes up reasons for not helping states when they ask for help. He's just too incompetent to actually do it even if he wanted to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liberty Posted May 5, 2020 Share Posted May 5, 2020 Trump brags about doing things that are consensual. Trump has never bragged about assault. The women disagree with you that it was consensual, including the 13 yr old girl that Trump allegedly raped in Jeffery Epstein's apartment: The number of women who have accused Trump of rape or sexual assault is at least 12 https://www.mic.com/articles/156669/how-many-women-have-accused-donald-trump-of-rape-or-sexual-assault#.KujVwb2jl I could pay someone to accuse you of raping them when they were 12...that doesn't mean that it happened. Trump is not epstein or weinstein or cosby...there is nothing credible or convicted (or even prosecuted). Again, you can't say "____ brags about assaulting women" when assault is a crime he has never been convicted of (or even prosecuted for). He bragged about getting women because of fame and money - you have to be really ignorant to be oblivious to this. Anyone who says that just sounds jealous that he gets laid because he has fame and money (and you don't, so you feel some need to take him down). https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Donald_Trump_sexual_misconduct_allegations Bonus if you can find me similar amount of allegations against other wealthy/famous people where all the allegations turned out were untrue. I mean, just based on who Trump is, I'd be way more surprised if he hadn't committed sexual assault than if he had. He's breaking all other rules of ethics and cares only about himself, has no shame or remorse for anything, and we know how he talks about women and how he's cheated on all his wives (including with a porn star that he paid hush money to), so what would be most out of character? Do you also believe in the tooth fairy? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 5, 2020 Share Posted May 5, 2020 How about we bailout states but also give the same amount of money to every other state? If they want to use it for healthcare or some other reason, it's up to each one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cobafdek Posted May 5, 2020 Share Posted May 5, 2020 Chinese propaganda bots have infected CoBF. Examples: https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/trump-admin-seizing-ppe/ "Under U.S. President Donald Trump, federal authorities are confiscating orders of personal protective equipment (PPE) from local governments amid the COVID-19 pandemic." https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1257741326650470400?s=20 Well run States should not be bailing out poorly run States, using CoronaVirus as the excuse! The elimination of Sanctuary Cities, Payroll Taxes, and perhaps Capital Gains Taxes, must be put on the table. Also lawsuit indemnification & business deductions for restaurants & ent. How to politicize a pandemic and basically blackmail people in doing your pet wishes while witholding the help that they need and deserve by being, y'know, part of the country. What he calls bailouts are actually just being a single country. When New Orleans or Mississippi or Florida gets hit by a huge hurricane and they get help, are they getting "bailed out" by the other states or is helping the worst hit places just the function of a government? The most urban states are worse hit first by pandemics, that's biology, but he's claiming this is some kind of political thing to punish enemies. How sociopathic do you have to be as people are suffering and dying? Don't the urban coastal states pay a lot more to the federal government than many of the poorer states that aren't too badly hit yet? So they are supposed to pay more and get less in return? When he bailed out farmers when his tarrifs hurt them, that was fine because it was political allies, right? Is he trying to break up the United States? He must have read the weekend's headlines about his party deserting him, so he's showing support for eliminating cap gains, expanding business deduction limits, and cutting payroll taxes. And he's using coronavirus as the excuse to cover his tracks of obviously buying votes here, and covering his tracks of using that excuse by first accusing Democrats of using Coronavirus as an excuse. https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/kushner-coronavirus-effort-said-to-be-hampered-by-inexperienced-volunteers/2020/05/05/6166ef0c-8e1c-11ea-9e23-6914ee410a5f_story.html I guess that's partly why Trump makes up reasons for not helping states when they ask for help. He's just too incompetent to actually do it even if he wanted to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liberty Posted May 5, 2020 Share Posted May 5, 2020 How about we bailout states but also give the same amount of money to every other state? If they want to use it for healthcare or some other reason, it's up to each one. It's not a bailout. It's what countries do when there's natural disasters. This isn't charity. These places contribute to the federal government, it's their money, their government too. Should everyone get FEMA help when Florida gets hit? When there's floods in the midwest? Do Mississippi and New York pay the same amount to the federal government? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liberty Posted May 5, 2020 Share Posted May 5, 2020 Chinese propaganda bots have infected CoBF. Examples: If you have any facts to share on COVID19 or the response to the crisis, go for it. Otherwise, you're the Trump propaganda bot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ERICOPOLY Posted May 5, 2020 Share Posted May 5, 2020 you have to be really ignorant to be oblivious to this. Anyone who says that just sounds jealous that he gets laid because he has fame and money (and you don't, so you feel some need to take him down). Child. I have to be really ignorant to disagree with you? Just jealous? Oh yeah, fame and money just attract these accusations... Gates, Buffett, famous and far richer. So many women coming forward against them too, no? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dwy000 Posted May 5, 2020 Share Posted May 5, 2020 you have to be really ignorant to be oblivious to this. Anyone who says that just sounds jealous that he gets laid because he has fame and money (and you don't, so you feel some need to take him down). Child. I have to be really ignorant to disagree with you? Just jealous? Oh yeah, fame and money just attract these accusations... Gates, Buffett, famous and far richer. So many women coming forward against them too, no? Why would he need to when he is in such a loving, committed, close knit marriage? Donald and Melania are inseparable and monogamous for life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardGibbons Posted May 5, 2020 Share Posted May 5, 2020 Child. I have to be really ignorant to disagree with you? Just jealous? Oh yeah, fame and money just attract these accusations... Gates, Buffett, famous and far richer. So many women coming forward against them too, no? Really, it's just shameful, so embarrassing. I'm baffled that people would make such ridiculous arguments. If someone wants to defend Trump, why don't they actually make arguments that are at least somewhat credible? He's done some good stuff, so why on earth would they make stupid arguments that don't stand up at all? I mean, there's a reason that they support him, right? So why don't they talk about the good, solid reasons they have for supporting him rather than tossing out all this stuff that nobody with an ounce of brains would believe? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gregmal Posted May 5, 2020 Share Posted May 5, 2020 Chinese propaganda bots have infected CoBF. Examples: If you have any facts to share on COVID19 or the response to the crisis, go for it. Otherwise, you're the Trump propaganda bot. Liberty I know this is 2020 and all, but Twitter links arent facts either. Nor are the tweets themselves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liberty Posted May 5, 2020 Share Posted May 5, 2020 To really hammer the point home about how ludicrous the idea is, envision you are trump and have his personality. Think long and hard about it, and the ego. Do you really think someone like that would say they need to assault a women to get laid? This would be a total contradiction to the personality. Requiring assault to get laid is an admission you couldn't do it on your own...this is a total contradiction to Trumps talk-track...he would never "brag about assaulting women". He would brag about getting laid (consensually) because of who he is (fame/wealth/personality)...those who don't see this are failing an iq test or just simply blinded by jealousy. btw, you're also totally misreading this part too. It's about power. He's saying, I can do whatever I want, they let me do it, I kiss them, I grab them. Don't you wish you could just do it too? I have access to all these beautiful women because I'm famous and wealthy, the normal rules don't apply to me. You can't do that, but I can. That's what he was bragging about. He wasn't saying I tie them up in dark alleys with a ski mask and then run away, that would be a low status thing. What he bragged about was high status assault, and in his mind it's not assault, it's just a normal privilege of being him, because he's so dazzling all women he meet must deep down want it (despite him looking like a Costco-size sack of potatoes). He's more or the Roger Ailes or Bill O'Reilley school of sexual misconduct, if you will. I'm famous and powerful, I can get them to do what I want. Like Harvey Weinstein, too. It worked really well in the pre-internet era because Trump's friend in the tabloid could buy the stories, have them sign NDAs, and then never publish. https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2018/dec/12/national-enquirer-trump-payments-david-pecker-catch-and-kill https://money.cnn.com/2018/02/16/media/trump-catch-and-kill/index.html https://www.newsweek.com/national-enquirer-60-trump-damaging-stories-ronan-farrow-catch-kill-1467445 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liberty Posted May 5, 2020 Share Posted May 5, 2020 Liberty I know this is 2020 and all, but Twitter links arent facts either. Nor are the tweets themselves. Only things engraved in stone tablets count, right? Because it's the medium that matters, not what is written, if it makes sense, and who said it and what the original source is and the fact that it can be verified elsewhere, right? I mean, I thought you'd like that I also enjoy Trump's favorite medium and source of information. ...as you write this on an internet forum, much higher in the hierarchy.. ::) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gregmal Posted May 5, 2020 Share Posted May 5, 2020 Liberty I know this is 2020 and all, but Twitter links arent facts either. Nor are the tweets themselves. Only things engraved in stone tablets count, right? Because it's the medium that matters, not what is written, if it makes sense, and who said it and what the original source is and the fact that it can be verified elsewhere, right? I mean, I thought you'd like that I also enjoy Trump's favorite medium and source of information. ...as you write this on an internet forum, much higher in the hierarchy.. ::) Im not saying or disputing any of that. Just pointing out the irony of telling a guy to bring facts when the bulk of the stuff you post are Twitter links and opinions or skewed interpretations from biased people. An indirect way of giving legitimacy to you own opinion(unless you feel different then the messages displayed in what you post). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liberty Posted May 5, 2020 Share Posted May 5, 2020 Im not saying or disputing any of that. Just pointing out the irony of telling a guy to bring facts when the bulk of the stuff you post are Twitter links and opinions or skewed interpretations from biased people. An indirect way of giving legitimacy to you own opinion(unless you feel different then the messages displayed in what you post). If you or him have anything specific to say about anything that I write, say that. Now you're just like him and not saying anything at all. Some of you guys act like analysis shouldn't exist, while at the same time spending your days analyzing companies and markets based on incomplete information and pattern-matching and your experience. Make up your mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gregmal Posted May 5, 2020 Share Posted May 5, 2020 Thats not what Im saying at all. Posting an opinion from someone on Twitter isn't a fact. Thats all. Frankly, Ive always been of the opinion that the majority of people on Twitter are total losers. Specifically ones that sit around all day commenting on stupid shit like memes and raising controversies that dont really have any purpose, POTUS 45 would be the grandest example of this, but 95% of Twitter users fall into this category. Its a way for little people to feel important. Very, very self inflating being able to # and tweet @ important people like celebrities and media personalities too; a cheap lotto ticket shot at your 15 minutes of fame. On a separate note, https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/05/05/sweden-says-coronavirus-cases-likely-country-early-november/ But hey, IT NEVER, EVER, EVER, EVA, coulda been in California or NY in January or February.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Casey Posted May 5, 2020 Share Posted May 5, 2020 Just because some internet clowns paid 25$ for a COBF membership doesn't mean you have to argue with them for 100 pages. <pig in the mud quote> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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