Elon Musk...human? - Political

[Sweet]

1 hour ago, rogermunibond said:

Still waiting for someone to quote Burke

“He that wrestles with us strengthens our nerves and sharpens our skill. Our antagonist is our helper.”  Done 

[lnofeisone]

Here we go - https://federalnewsnetwork.com/federal-newscast/2025/03/national-science-foundation-rehires-half-of-employees-fired-two-weeks-ago/

 

NSF is now bringing back workers who were illegally let go. They will also be getting back pay, and I suspect there will be lawsuit compensation for them in the future. If only this admin had followed the process and done it the right way, as most of the HR departments had told them to do. Talk about waste and abuse. Throw in DOJ lying to courts on OPM's behalf and you have fraud. 

[John Hjorth]

Here is Elon Musks post on X with data from the social security database, that ended up being commented on in POTUSs speech at the US Capitol tuesday evening - moving it to here, because it has nothing to do with the Russian-Ukrainian war. [You'll have to click on the table to see the whole thingy] [ @Xerxes ]

 

After that follows DOGEs similar post on X.

 

 

 

 

Edited 14 hours ago by John Hjorth

[lnofeisone]

21 minutes ago, John Hjorth said:

Here is Elon Musks post on X with data from the social security database, that ended up being commented on in POTUSs speech at the US Capitol tuesday evening - moving it to here, because it has nothing to do with the Russian-Ukrainian war. [You'll have to click on the table to see the whole thingy] [ @Xerxes ]

 

After that follows DOGEs similar post on X.

 

 

 

 

Yeah, this is has been so thoroughly debunked. Turns out SSA was aware of this (not shocking) and chose the smart thing to do, which was to allow the system reach its end of life instead of spending ridiculous amounts to modernize it.

 

Oh, and DOGE and Elon couldn't produce numbers that included people who were over 100, dead, and receiving payments. A straightforward query.

[gfp]

That's what I wanted to see!  A query that showed implausibly old people receiving actual disbursements!  C'mon guys, print that report out 

[lnofeisone]

One of several reasons why they couldn't produce it is because there are a bunch of people in that database that were born 100+ years ago but there was little or no documentation of their birth or death. So SSA knows these people exist because they worked and paid SS, but they don't have exact birthdates or the documents of their deaths haven't been submitted. It's somewhat recent that death documentation gets sent to SSA (coroners, hospitals, credit card companies are now required to do so). 

 

So database has these people but they don't get any checks sent to them. Sure, there might be some grandma stuck in a freezer somewhere and her grandson is collecting her checks but that's not really gov't's fraud, waste, and abuse. 

[sfbm21]

All smoke and mirrors. This is not payments db . We are looking at wrong place 

[John Hjorth]

5 minutes ago, lnofeisone said:

... So database has these people but they don't get any checks sent to them. Sure, there might be some grandma stuck in a freezer somewhere and her grandson is collecting her checks but that's not really gov't's fraud, waste, and abuse. 

 

I personally thought that method was for mother-in-laws only! 

[lnofeisone]

2 minutes ago, John Hjorth said:

 

I personally thought that method was for mother-in-laws only! 

We hurt the ones we love the most. I'm going with grandma over MIL. 

[gfp]

I avoid renting anything under section 8 (HUD) as a landlord because in my market you tend to have entire extended families moving into granny's apartment and they do strange stuff (like doing all their laundry in a huge clawfoot tub because they don't pay the water bill, etc.)

 

But I guarantee you there are quite a few dead grannies who go completely unreported so that the 3 generations of people living in her HUD apartment don't have to move out.  In the freezer or buried in the yard, I don't know.

[73 Reds]

15 minutes ago, gfp said:

I avoid renting anything under section 8 (HUD) as a landlord because in my market you tend to have entire extended families moving into granny's apartment and they do strange stuff (like doing all their laundry in a huge clawfoot tub because they don't pay the water bill, etc.)

 

But I guarantee you there are quite a few dead grannies who go completely unreported so that the 3 generations of people living in her HUD apartment don't have to move out.  In the freezer or buried in the yard, I don't know.

@gfp many years ago I served as a Hearing Officer for HUD cases involving disputes between property owners and Section 8 tenants.  The number one issue by far was too many residents occupying a single residence, due in no small part to the subsidies each resident was receiving.  The tenants were experts at gaming a system in which the Govt. had no chance of forcing compliance.  Like you, the lesson learned was Section 8 housing was not worth the headaches, as a property owner.  The flipside is, there is a lot of money to be made but you need the right mental framework and a full time maintenance staff.

Edited 12 hours ago by 73 Reds
spacing

[rogermunibond]

I'm in a state where Section 8 income cannot be rejected when searching for tenants.  It's an onerous slog.

 

There are limits on the number of unrelated persons who can live in a home but not on the number of directly related individuals iirc.

[John Hjorth]

There is another point to the whole thing about how this DOGE work is done.

 

As far as I have understood, the data has been transperferred [copied] to servers outside the department in mention, those servers in control of DOGE alone, indicating isolated analysis with no real communication between the department and DOGE about conclusions and findings, meaning no going to the department with results and conclusions on DOGEs work for discussion and comments, and hopefully agreements about conclusions.

 

It is one of the first things one learn as an auditor when you are out of the office and 'in the field' to work at a client. Get conclusions verified, so no time is wasted by presenting trivial misperceptions misjudgements and wrong conclusions to superiors.

 

One do not enter the door at the client with a 'here I come' attitude, but do always approach staff members at the client in a forthcoming, positive and respectfull way, or else that particular person will cut you off from getting information by never answering any of your questions next time in the future.

 

One start with : 'x, Have I understood this correctly , that ...'.

 

Is not ones job in such a situation to act and behave as if it's the mideval Spanish inquisiton under a witch trial.

 

With DOGEs purpose, such sh*te are almost for sure doomed to happen, and this is likely an example of it.

Edited 12 hours ago by John Hjorth

[73 Reds]

4 minutes ago, rogermunibond said:

I'm in a state where Section 8 income cannot be rejected when searching for tenants.  It's an onerous slog.

 

There are limits on the number of unrelated persons who can live in a home but not on the number of directly related individuals iirc.

There were (surely still are ) guidelines as to the maximum number of residents who can occupy a home with xx bedrooms and xx baths.

[rogermunibond]

10 minutes ago, 73 Reds said:

There were (surely still are ) guidelines as to the maximum number of residents who can occupy a home with xx bedrooms and xx baths.

 

Strangely enough I've never seen such in the county code.

 

Occupancy is reflected in the Fire Code but that doesn't seem really specific to residential SFHs.

[73 Reds]

1 minute ago, rogermunibond said:

 

Strangely enough I've never seen such in the county code.

 

Occupancy is reflected in the Fire Code but that doesn't seem really specific to residential SFHs.

These were enforceable HUD guidelines.  As a private landlord, my written lease always provides for permanent occupancy only by those tenants identified in the lease agreement.    

[Xerxes]

1 hour ago, John Hjorth said:

Here is Elon Musks post on X with data from the social security database, that ended up being commented on in POTUSs speech at the US Capitol tuesday evening - moving it to here, because it has nothing to do with the Russian-Ukrainian war. [You'll have to click on the table to see the whole thingy] [ @Xerxes ]

 

After that follows DOGEs similar post on X.

 

 

 

 

 

1 hour ago, lnofeisone said:

Yeah, this is has been so thoroughly debunked. Turns out SSA was aware of this (not shocking) and chose the smart thing to do, which was to allow the system reach its end of life instead of spending ridiculous amounts to modernize it.

 

Oh, and DOGE and Elon couldn't produce numbers that included people who were over 100, dead, and receiving payments. A straightforward query.

 

Thanks gents. 
 

Ps:

odd thing to bring up in State of Union speech. 

[gfp]

2 minutes ago, Xerxes said:

Ps:

odd thing to bring up in State of Union speech. 

 

that wasn't a state of the union speech.  That was a standard trump rally

[lnofeisone]

26 minutes ago, 73 Reds said:

There were (surely still are ) guidelines as to the maximum number of residents who can occupy a home with xx bedrooms and xx baths.

I don't do section 8 because of the headaches that come with it, but I have heard anecdotes that fire code violation and limited water pressure to accommodate individuals beyond what's in the lease can be used as a way to evict tenants. That's in DC which a lot of people purport to be a tenant friendly local. 

[73 Reds]

9 minutes ago, lnofeisone said:

I don't do section 8 because of the headaches that come with it, but I have heard anecdotes that fire code violation and limited water pressure to accommodate individuals beyond what's in the lease can be used as a way to evict tenants. That's in DC which a lot of people purport to be a tenant friendly local. 

Yeah, I literally grew up in the real estate business and as an older teenager worked part-time and summers as a rental agent/property manager for a Section 8 apartment community.  Talk about an education; drugs, prostitution and criminal activity were rampant throughout the complex and the surrounding community.   Repairs only lasted for days or weeks and were like band aids.  No sooner was one apartment rented than two needed to file for evictions.  There were always good-hearted families trying hard to overcome the conditions but it was far from easy and most left when they could.   Tenant turnover was very high but there were always new tenants who "qualfied" as soon as an apartment went vacant and could be patched up.  

[lnofeisone]

10 minutes ago, 73 Reds said:

Yeah, I literally grew up in the real estate business and as an older teenager worked part-time and summers as a rental agent/property manager for a Section 8 apartment community.  Talk about an education; drugs, prostitution and criminal activity were rampant throughout the complex and the surrounding community.   Repairs only lasted for days or weeks and were like band aids.  No sooner was one apartment rented than two needed to file for evictions.  There were always good-hearted families trying hard to overcome the conditions but it was far from easy and most left when they could.   Tenant turnover was very high but there were always new tenants who "qualfied" as soon as an apartment went vacant and could be patched up.  

When I was growing up, we were section 8 in NYCHA. Incidentally, I grew up in the same projects Howard Schultz grew up in, though they took a turn for the worse from when he was there. I know exactly what you are speaking of in terms of drugs, criminal activity, etc. and how hard it can be to get out. Part of the reason why I would never want to deal with section 8 housing. People that do are just built different. 

[Spekulatius]

1 hour ago, 73 Reds said:

@gfp many years ago I served as a Hearing Officer for HUD cases involving disputes between property owners and Section 8 tenants.  The number one issue by far was too many residents occupying a single residence, due in no small part to the subsidies each resident was receiving.  The tenants were experts at gaming a system in which the Govt. had no chance of forcing compliance.  Like you, the lesson learned was Section 8 housing was not worth the headaches, as a property owner.  The flipside is, there is a lot of money to be made but you need the right mental framework and a full time maintenance staff.

You don’t well these issues combing databases , especially  if you don’t understand how they are operated which the DOGE team clearly does not. Got to get boots on the ground but that is not what has been happening .

 

I also wonder what’s is up with all those IRS firings during tax season.

[lnofeisone]

12 minutes ago, Spekulatius said:

I also wonder what’s is up with all those IRS firings during tax season.

Part of the IRS handling the filing season isn't getting hit. That's the IT bunch. The compliance and enforcement are getting gutted. Those are the revenue agents focusing on large businesses and international and just broad compliance programs. 

[Gregmal]

Maybe they should’ve changed the date the new administration takes over to September or May or something so that on the odd chance that you get that outlier president who actually wants to get things done it won’t seem suspicious for people whom find everything he does suspicious….just an idea! 

[lnofeisone]

22 minutes ago, Gregmal said:

Maybe they should’ve changed the date the new administration takes over to September or May or something so that on the odd chance that you get that outlier president who actually wants to get things done it won’t seem suspicious for people whom find everything he does suspicious….just an idea! 

Gov't processes aren't synched like that. Something is happening every single month (for example, Gov't FY starts on Oct 1st), so there is no excellent transition month that won't set off fireworks. Especially when fireworks are poorly thought out and largely illegal. 

 

Speaking of our outlier leader, he just crossed favorable/unfavorable (very much entering unfavorable). Even Joe Biden took 9 months to get to this point. 

https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/polls/favorability/donald-trump/