"20-Year-Old Robinhood Customer Commits Suicide After Seeing -$730,000 Balance"

[Liberty]

So tragic.

 

https://www.forbes.com/sites/sergeiklebnikov/2020/06/17/20-year-old-robinhood-customer-commits-suicide-after-seeing-a-730000-negative-balance/#5554895f5928

 

Here's Bill Brewster telling the story about his cousin:

 

 

 

[Luke 532]

Wow, that is crushing.  Thank you for sharing.  Will be praying for his family.

[Guest cherzeca]

I have dealt with late teen suicides, thankfully none in my family, but always a tragedy.  as best I can tell, many of these kids come to what they believe is a "no way out" position, they have done something that turns out bad and they develop huge shame and guilt, and feel they cant talk to no one, and even worse, they cant talk to the people they would normally be able to talk to (parents), and so they do an act that cannot be retrieved.  I am not discussing teens with drugs addictions or mental health issues, they are a whole other problem, but I am talking about the healthy lovable and sometimes frustrating teen in your house.  I have come to believe that you need to "premortem" teenagers, tell them in advance that NOTHING is not redeemable, that there is no no way out position or end point.  the kids will look you in the eye and wonder what is wrong with you, but just tell them this nonetheless and that you love them

[Liberty]

I have dealt with late teen suicides, thankfully none in my family, but always a tragedy.  as best I can tell, many of these kids come to what they believe is a "no way out" position, they have done something that turns out bad and they develop huge shame and guilt, and feel they cant talk to no one, and even worse, they cant talk to the people they would normally be able to talk to (parents), and so they do an act that cannot be retrieved.  I am not discussing teens with drugs addictions or mental health issues, they are a whole other problem, but I am talking about the healthy lovable and sometimes frustrating teen in your house.  I have come to believe that you need to "premortem" teenagers, tell them in advance that NOTHING is not redeemable, that there is no no way out position or end point.  the kids will look you in the eye and wonder what is wrong with you, but just tell them this nonetheless and that you love them

 

Thanks for sharing. Yes, I think that's a good approach, something to think about with my boys when they're a bit older. I think these situations are probably even worse with really good people who care and are trying really hard to do good, because they put immense pressure on themselves, on top of whatever external pressure may be present (real or imagined).

[Guest cherzeca]

I have dealt with late teen suicides, thankfully none in my family, but always a tragedy.  as best I can tell, many of these kids come to what they believe is a "no way out" position, they have done something that turns out bad and they develop huge shame and guilt, and feel they cant talk to no one, and even worse, they cant talk to the people they would normally be able to talk to (parents), and so they do an act that cannot be retrieved.  I am not discussing teens with drugs addictions or mental health issues, they are a whole other problem, but I am talking about the healthy lovable and sometimes frustrating teen in your house.  I have come to believe that you need to "premortem" teenagers, tell them in advance that NOTHING is not redeemable, that there is no no way out position or end point.  the kids will look you in the eye and wonder what is wrong with you, but just tell them this nonetheless and that you love them

 

Thanks for sharing. Yes, I think that's a good approach, something to think about with my boys when they're a bit older. I think these situations are probably even worse with really good people who care and are trying really hard to do good, because they put immense pressure on themselves, on top of whatever external pressure may be present (real or imagined).

 

this is exactly it.  our kids want to make us feel proud so bad that when they screw up, as we all do and they will, they need to know in advance that it is ok, or at least it can be made ok, or at least they will be forgiven

[writser]

The saddest thing is that he didn't even actually blow up his account - he just thought he did.

[rkbabang]

The saddest thing is that he didn't even actually blow up his account - he just thought he did.

 

I know.  The question he typed as his suicide note should have been an email to Robinhood customer support. Did no one ever tell him that if you don't understand something, ask?

[aryadhana]

The saddest thing is that he didn't even actually blow up his account - he just thought he did.

 

I'm a little more disturbed that he thought he was personally liable and that there was some way Robinhood could, say, make his parents contribute the amount of his debit balance even if he had blown up. 

 

 

[SharperDingaan]

20-year olds are not teens, they are almost adults.

In a great many places, teens are forcibly drafted into the military at 18, and subject to a range of various abuses. No bubble wrap.

 

Different places, different approaches, but the aim is the same - grow up. Rapidly.

Shortly after their 16th birthdays, each of our nephews was shot up with every vaccine known to man, and spent a fully immersed week volunteering in an african refugee camp. Sleep/eat/shit on site, see the disease, smell the dying, hear the crying, and see the predatory praying on the hopeless. They both came back horrified - but each has quietly thanked us multiple times for the experience.

 

You don't know what you have, until you don't.

It also makes you very difficult to bully, and bend to social pressure.

 

SD

 

 

 

[LC]

You don't know what you have, until you don't.

It also makes you very difficult to bully, and bend to social pressure.

 

There are some benefits to experiencing poverty and disease. As they say, there can be no light without the dark.

[Read the Footnotes]

20-year olds are not teens, they are almost adults.

In a great many places, teens are forcibly drafted into the military at 18, and subject to a range of various abuses. No bubble wrap.

 

Different places, different approaches, but the aim is the same - grow up. Rapidly.

Shortly after their 16th birthdays, each of our nephews was shot up with every vaccine known to man, and spent a fully immersed week volunteering in an african refugee camp. Sleep/eat/shit on site, see the disease, smell the dying, hear the crying, and see the predatory praying on the hopeless. They both came back horrified - but each has quietly thanked us multiple times for the experience.

 

You don't know what you have, until you don't.

It also makes you very difficult to bully, and bend to social pressure.

 

SD

In the USA, this is a kid who likely couldn't have rented a rental car because the expectation is that his brain is not fully matured.

 

Many people who spend time with young people believe in an extended adolescence at least in the USA. I won't debate the merits, or issues, etc, but on average, today's 20 year olds don't seem that much like the 20 years olds of days long gone or the twenty year olds in many other regions.

 

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/extended-adolescence-when-25-is-the-new-181/

[rb]

So the kid did actually kill himself. I had some doubts about that.

 

Now I'm not a lawyer, but I know that some of you are. So how does this not rise to the level of criminal negligence?

 

P.S. That Bill Brewster is a real deuche.

[Read the Footnotes]

So the kid did actually kill himself. I had some doubts about that.

 

Now I'm not a lawyer, but I know that some of you are. So how does this not rise to the level of criminal negligence?

 

P.S. That Bill Brewster is a real deuche.

That's not the right attitude. Remember, the right answer is "move fast and break things."

[Jurgis]

So the kid did actually kill himself. I had some doubts about that.

 

Now I'm not a lawyer, but I know that some of you are. So how does this not rise to the level of criminal negligence?

 

P.S. That Bill Brewster is a real deuche.

 

Is it a criminal negligence to send the 1.1mln Covid bill to the person even if he will not need to pay it ( https://time.com/5853392/million-dollars-covid-19-treatment-seattle/ )? Or is it criminal negligence only if he kills himself after seeing the bill (that he may not need to pay)?

 

Edit: is it criminal negligence for Fidelity to display that my accounts have $0 dollars in them (and all my lifetime savings have vanished) or is it criminal negligence only if I kill myself after seeing this? (Yes, this happened.)

[Liberty]

The saddest thing is that he didn't even actually blow up his account - he just thought he did.

 

I know.  The question he typed as his suicide note should have been an email to Robinhood customer support. Did no one ever tell him that if you don't understand something, ask?

 

The thing is, when you don't understand something, you don't always know you don't understand it. He thought it was quite clear, and that he was almost a million in the red, and the way the interface is built, with no other indications, it's pretty easy to make that mistake. If he had time to think clearly, he probably would've figured it out, but that's what's dangerous about panic, you can do things that you can't undo..

[Liberty]

P.S. That Bill Brewster is a real deuche.

 

Bill is a friend of mine. But thanks for making it clear who's the real one here.

[rkbabang]

is it criminal negligence for Fidelity to display that my accounts have $0 dollars in them (and all my lifetime savings have vanished) or is it criminal negligence only if I kill myself after seeing this? (Yes, this happened.)

 

I was just thinking the same thing.  That has happened more than once.  This man (not kid) saw a number on an app and killed himself without finding out what was really going on.  That isn't healthy thinking/state of mind by any measure.

 

[rb]

is it criminal negligence for Fidelity to display that my accounts have $0 dollars in them (and all my lifetime savings have vanished) or is it criminal negligence only if I kill myself after seeing this? (Yes, this happened.)

 

I was just thinking the same thing.  That has happened more than once.  This man (not kid) saw a number on an app and killed himself without finding out what was really going on.  That isn't healthy thinking/state of mind by any measure.

Well I know that neither rk nor Jurgis are lawyers so we may be whistling Dixie out of our ass here.

 

But history has many documented cases where large market losses can induce individuals into an unhealthy state of mind. It's the reason why we can't open up a window in an office buildings or at least the ones I worked in because I was in finance.

 

I'd venture further in my whistling that while you knew it was some sort of error, the kid didn't know because he knew he was doing something risky so the result at least seemed plausible. The thing is no matter what your personal views are brokerages are not supposed to allow this sort of behaviour. But places like Robinhood, eToro, and others not only allow it, they encourage it.

 

So the criminal negligence is - in my view - that given how you are set up and your behaviour it is reasonable to expect that horrible things like this will happen.

[rb]

P.S. That Bill Brewster is a real deuche.

 

Bill is a friend of mine. But thanks for making it clear who's the real one here.

So what if he's your friend? Does that preclude him from being a deuche? Does that make me one for saying so?

 

The reason I had doubts about whether the story was real was his casual attitude about it.

 

His twitter was like I'm loving this guy who promotes risky and irresponsible trades. Ok, Public Service Announcement, kids, the markets are bananas right now. Here's the story about my wife's cousin who killed himself because he lost a lot of money doing risky and irresponsible trades. So be careful out there and stay safe. OK, PSA over. Man, I'm loving this guy that does risky and irresponsible trades.

 

But he's you'r friend. So....

[John Hjorth]

I have dealt with late teen suicides, thankfully none in my family, but always a tragedy.  as best I can tell, many of these kids come to what they believe is a "no way out" position, they have done something that turns out bad and they develop huge shame and guilt, and feel they cant talk to no one, and even worse, they cant talk to the people they would normally be able to talk to (parents), and so they do an act that cannot be retrieved.  I am not discussing teens with drugs addictions or mental health issues, they are a whole other problem, but I am talking about the healthy lovable and sometimes frustrating teen in your house.  I have come to believe that you need to "premortem" teenagers, tell them in advance that NOTHING is not redeemable, that there is no no way out position or end point.  the kids will look you in the eye and wonder what is wrong with you, but just tell them this nonetheless and that you love them.

 

Thank you for sharing, cherzeca,

 

Your post is actually a heartbreaking read, to me. Personally, I'm pretty sure that you're rooted in good & decent soil.

[Gregmal]

And, despite sad stories like this, and much of the country in shambles financially, we still haven't "mustered up" the courage to demand even basic, entry level financial literacy courses for our high school students....nah, we need all those important schedule blocks for study hall, literature, and photography...

[rb]

And, despite sad stories like this, and much of the country in shambles financially, we still haven't "mustered up" the courage to demand even basic, entry level financial literacy courses for our high school students....nah, we need all those important schedule blocks for study hall, literature, and photography...

I fully agree with you on financial education. But in this case, those classes probably won't cover option strategies.

[Guest cherzeca]

I have dealt with late teen suicides, thankfully none in my family, but always a tragedy.  as best I can tell, many of these kids come to what they believe is a "no way out" position, they have done something that turns out bad and they develop huge shame and guilt, and feel they cant talk to no one, and even worse, they cant talk to the people they would normally be able to talk to (parents), and so they do an act that cannot be retrieved.  I am not discussing teens with drugs addictions or mental health issues, they are a whole other problem, but I am talking about the healthy lovable and sometimes frustrating teen in your house.  I have come to believe that you need to "premortem" teenagers, tell them in advance that NOTHING is not redeemable, that there is no no way out position or end point.  the kids will look you in the eye and wonder what is wrong with you, but just tell them this nonetheless and that you love them.

 

Thank you for sharing, cherzeca,

 

Your post is actually a heartbreaking read, to me. Personally, I'm pretty sure that you're rooted in good & decent soil.

 

thank you John.  lots of tears at the times.

[Liberty]

P.S. That Bill Brewster is a real deuche.

 

Bill is a friend of mine. But thanks for making it clear who's the real one here.

So what if he's your friend? Does that preclude him from being a deuche? Does that make me one for saying so?

 

The reason I had doubts about whether the story was real was his casual attitude about it.

 

His twitter was like I'm loving this guy who promotes risky and irresponsible trades. Ok, Public Service Announcement, kids, the markets are bananas right now. Here's the story about my wife's cousin who killed himself because he lost a lot of money doing risky and irresponsible trades. So be careful out there and stay safe. OK, PSA over. Man, I'm loving this guy that does risky and irresponsible trades.

 

But he's you'r friend. So....

 

Dude, the kid didn't even lose the money, Robinhood interface showed -730k USD that he didn't owe (as far as we can tell), and he panicked and made a really bad decision, as humans sometimes do during panic. And if you think he has a casual attitude about it.. Man, thanks for providing more proof you're the real one here. A real gem you are. Thank you for your contribution to this thread about a 20 year old's suicide.

[rb]

P.S. That Bill Brewster is a real deuche.

 

Bill is a friend of mine. But thanks for making it clear who's the real one here.

So what if he's your friend? Does that preclude him from being a deuche? Does that make me one for saying so?

 

The reason I had doubts about whether the story was real was his casual attitude about it.

 

His twitter was like I'm loving this guy who promotes risky and irresponsible trades. Ok, Public Service Announcement, kids, the markets are bananas right now. Here's the story about my wife's cousin who killed himself because he lost a lot of money doing risky and irresponsible trades. So be careful out there and stay safe. OK, PSA over. Man, I'm loving this guy that does risky and irresponsible trades.

 

But he's you'r friend. So....

 

Dude, the kid didn't even lose the money, Robinhood interface showed -730k USD that he didn't owe (as far as we can tell), and he panicked and made a really bad decision, as humans sometimes do during panic. And if you think he has a casual attitude about it.. Man, thanks for providing more proof you're the real one here. A real gem you are. Thank you for your contribution to this thread about a 20 year old's suicide.

I said he had a casual attitude about it. I read the thread when he posted it last weekend. At that point he didn't know whether the kid didn't loose money. From the thread:

 

So, he began buying and selling options. Fast forward to sometime this past week and his account showed him owing $700k+. How does a 20 year old with no income get access to that kind of leverage/exposure?!

 

PS. And a bit of a cover my ass here. I haven’t seen the actual account. I only know what his final note said. He cited the figure, I am relaying what he said.

 

Pretty clear he thought the kid lost a lot of money with the help of Robinhood.

 

Also the tweet after the thread that said DDTG all the way or something to that effect is now gone. I'm guessing because he's intelligent, looked at it again and thought what I thought. But hey, he's your friend so fuck myself.