We are so screwed!

[Spekulatius]

Interesting - I see more talk about bailouts and government interventions here than I see in discussions in Germany.

 

Market crashing and everyone is turning into Bernie. We may get UBI and Medicare for all and nobody is going to blink.

 

Not saying it is right or wrong, but it is surprising to me.

[Guest]

I suppose that I don't think the economy, in its current state, should be saved. There is a very real reason why Trump got elected, why Sanders is popular, why something like 40% of people can't come up with $400 in an emergency, huge student debt, etc.

 

The one time hands out become permanent. Look at interest rates!

 

Humans need to experience pain in order to advance. It's like going to the gym. If you don't work out your body and just eat cheap junk food, it becomes frail. That is the current system. Shocks are good! I give Taleb credit for that thought.

 

[Castanza]

Interesting - I see more talk about bailouts and government interventions here than I see in discussions in Germany.

 

Market crashing and everyone is turning into Bernie. We may get UBI and Medicare for all and nobody is going to blink.

 

Not saying it is right or wrong, but it is surprising to me.

 

Free market principles are abandoned the minute the govt says you can't do this and you can't do that. This is a very different situation from past financial crises. I wouldn't have supported bailouts in 2008 for anyone.

 

I agree that individuals should have emergency funds, responsibility is important.

 

You can't lock someone in a jail cell and then tell them to feed and support themselves. Either let stuff stay open and provide no type of assistance or close up shop and provide assistance with stipulations.

 

Can't have the cake and eat it too.

[Guest]

Interesting - I see more talk about bailouts and government interventions here than I see in discussions in Germany.

 

Market crashing and everyone is turning into Bernie. We may get UBI and Medicare for all and nobody is going to blink.

 

Not saying it is right or wrong, but it is surprising to me.

 

Free market principles are abandoned the minute the govt says you can't do this and you can't do that. This is a very different situation from past financial crises. I wouldn't have supported bailouts in 2008 for anyone.

 

I agree that individuals should have emergency funds, responsibility is important.

 

You can't lock someone in a jail cell and then tell them to feed and support themselves. Either let stuff stay open and provide no type of assistance or close up shop and provide assistance with stipulations.

 

Can't have the cake and eat it too.

 

Or...tap your 6 months of an emergency fund?

[SharperDingaan]

1.5K/month isn't enough, you'll need closer to 5K/month, and to every working person in the US for 6 months+.

Sure, some will not need the money. Just tax it back from income at a 100% tax rate, for all incomes between X & Y.

It's extraordinary times, and its called leadership.

 

SD

 

 

[Castanza]

Interesting - I see more talk about bailouts and government interventions here than I see in discussions in Germany.

 

Market crashing and everyone is turning into Bernie. We may get UBI and Medicare for all and nobody is going to blink.

 

Not saying it is right or wrong, but it is surprising to me.

 

Free market principles are abandoned the minute the govt says you can't do this and you can't do that. This is a very different situation from past financial crises. I wouldn't have supported bailouts in 2008 for anyone.

 

I agree that individuals should have emergency funds, responsibility is important.

 

You can't lock someone in a jail cell and then tell them to feed and support themselves. Either let stuff stay open and provide no type of assistance or close up shop and provide assistance with stipulations.

 

Can't have the cake and eat it too.

 

Or...tap your 6 months of an emergency fund?

 

To each their own. I know I'll be helping people where I can.

[Guest]

Interesting - I see more talk about bailouts and government interventions here than I see in discussions in Germany.

 

Market crashing and everyone is turning into Bernie. We may get UBI and Medicare for all and nobody is going to blink.

 

Not saying it is right or wrong, but it is surprising to me.

 

Free market principles are abandoned the minute the govt says you can't do this and you can't do that. This is a very different situation from past financial crises. I wouldn't have supported bailouts in 2008 for anyone.

 

I agree that individuals should have emergency funds, responsibility is important.

 

You can't lock someone in a jail cell and then tell them to feed and support themselves. Either let stuff stay open and provide no type of assistance or close up shop and provide assistance with stipulations.

 

Can't have the cake and eat it too.

 

Or...tap your 6 months of an emergency fund?

 

To each their own. I know I'll be helping people where I can.

 

Better than the government doing it. ;)

 

[gjangal]

The government should come out and send checks to everyone ( at least low wage / gig workers / need based ) . After all that’s what they are doing for the rich people who own assets in terms of QE and lowering interest rates.

 

Small businesses and honest hard working people who serve the community and are not able to do so now because of an act of god shouldn’t suffer

[Guest]

The government should come out and send checks to everyone ( at least low wage / gig workers / need based ) . After all that’s what they are doing for the rich people who own assets in terms of QE and lowering interest rates.

 

Small businesses and honest hard working people who serve the community and are not able to do so now because of an act of god shouldn’t suffer

 

Or the government should stop coddling everyone and let reality play out the way it should?

[shhughes1116]

The government should come out and send checks to everyone ( at least low wage / gig workers / need based ) . After all that’s what they are doing for the rich people who own assets in terms of QE and lowering interest rates.

 

Small businesses and honest hard working people who serve the community and are not able to do so now because of an act of god shouldn’t suffer

 

Or the government should stop coddling everyone and let reality play out the way it should?

 

If this was a run-of-the-mill recession, then I would agree with your mentality/statement.  We should let the market wring out the excesses via bankruptcy. 

 

However, the COVID-19 pandemic layers on an added and unique issue.  In the absence of some sort of paycheck (fiscal stimulus) coming from the guarantor of last resort (e.g. the Federal Gov), one of two things will happen:

1. People are not going to stay home because they need $$$ to put food on the table, and this pandemic will be far worse.  And it will crush our hospital system, leading to additional mortality from other treatable illnesses that can't find space/time at the hospital. 

2. People will stay home, businesses will go bankrupt in a truly large scale (taking CRE with it), and we will end up with a depression that takes decades to dig out of. 

 

The idea of fiscal stimulus, and monetary stimulus, bothers me - I don't like it for a lot of reasons.  But if some fiscal stimulus is needed, I'd much rather see that go directly into the pockets of a waitress trying to make ends meet, rather than a financial institution via a bail-out. 

 

And in this crisis, it is time to "Go Big or Go Home" with the fiscal stimulus.  Trump missed the boat to manage this crisis 2 months ago, and with every passing day, the cost of mitigation grows ever larger. 

 

 

[Guest]

The government should come out and send checks to everyone ( at least low wage / gig workers / need based ) . After all that’s what they are doing for the rich people who own assets in terms of QE and lowering interest rates.

 

Small businesses and honest hard working people who serve the community and are not able to do so now because of an act of god shouldn’t suffer

 

Or the government should stop coddling everyone and let reality play out the way it should?

 

If this was a run-of-the-mill recession, then I would agree with your mentality/statement.  We should let the market wring out the excesses via bankruptcy. 

 

However, the COVID-19 pandemic layers on an added and unique issue.  In the absence of some sort of paycheck (fiscal stimulus) coming from the guarantor of last resort (e.g. the Federal Gov), one of two things will happen:

1. People are not going to stay home because they need $$$ to put food on the table, and this pandemic will be far worse.  And it will crush our hospital system, leading to additional mortality from other treatable illnesses that can't find space/time at the hospital. 

2. People will stay home, businesses will go bankrupt in a truly large scale (taking CRE with it), and we will end up with a depression that takes decades to dig out of. 

 

The idea of fiscal stimulus, and monetary stimulus, bothers me - I don't like it for a lot of reasons.  But if some fiscal stimulus is needed, I'd much rather see that go directly into the pockets of a waitress trying to make ends meet, rather than a financial institution via a bail-out. 

 

And in this crisis, it is time to "Go Big or Go Home" with the fiscal stimulus.  Trump missed the boat to manage this crisis 2 months ago, and with every passing day, the cost of mitigation grows ever larger.

 

I think the reason that this will be worse than a run of the mill recession is due to previous coddling. Look at what the market did during the Spanish flu issue. Not this.

[scorpioncapital]

Agree. I'm a digital nomad and the government gives me nothing. Zip. Meanwhile cozy pencil pushers and bureaucrats get all kinds of social Benefits. Globalization is not really working unless it's a seamless web. Unfortunately too much nationalism and actually we see it now going backwards. With each tribe protecting only themselves and yet it's very limited resources if we don't work together globally.

[Spekulatius]

The government should come out and send checks to everyone ( at least low wage / gig workers / need based ) . After all that’s what they are doing for the rich people who own assets in terms of QE and lowering interest rates.

 

Small businesses and honest hard working people who serve the community and are not able to do so now because of an act of god shouldn’t suffer

 

Or the government should stop coddling everyone and let reality play out the way it should?

 

If this was a run-of-the-mill recession, then I would agree with your mentality/statement.  We should let the market wring out the excesses via bankruptcy. 

 

However, the COVID-19 pandemic layers on an added and unique issue.  In the absence of some sort of paycheck (fiscal stimulus) coming from the guarantor of last resort (e.g. the Federal Gov), one of two things will happen:

1. People are not going to stay home because they need $$$ to put food on the table, and this pandemic will be far worse.  And it will crush our hospital system, leading to additional mortality from other treatable illnesses that can't find space/time at the hospital. 

2. People will stay home, businesses will go bankrupt in a truly large scale (taking CRE with it), and we will end up with a depression that takes decades to dig out of. 

 

The idea of fiscal stimulus, and monetary stimulus, bothers me - I don't like it for a lot of reasons.  But if some fiscal stimulus is needed, I'd much rather see that go directly into the pockets of a waitress trying to make ends meet, rather than a financial institution via a bail-out. 

 

And in this crisis, it is time to "Go Big or Go Home" with the fiscal stimulus.  Trump missed the boat to manage this crisis 2 months ago, and with every passing day, the cost of mitigation grows ever larger.

 

I think the reason that this will be worse than a run of the mill recession is due to previous coddling. Look at what the market did during the Spanish flu issue. Not this.

 

Note that WW1 was won by the allies by the time  the Spanish flue became an issue. this lifted a huge burden from the economy (and created new issues) that overshadowed the Spanish flu impact.

 

QE doesnt help individuals, it helps institutions. Lower interest rates help institutions much more than individuals. Instead of helping the airlines, we should think about helping their employees for example.

 

Does AAL really deserve help, the way they managed their capital structure? They rolled the dice adding huge amount of debt  so I don’t see a problem letting them restructure.

[Guest Schwab711]

The government should come out and send checks to everyone ( at least low wage / gig workers / need based ) . After all that’s what they are doing for the rich people who own assets in terms of QE and lowering interest rates.

 

Small businesses and honest hard working people who serve the community and are not able to do so now because of an act of god shouldn’t suffer

 

Or the government should stop coddling everyone and let reality play out the way it should?

 

If this was a run-of-the-mill recession, then I would agree with your mentality/statement.  We should let the market wring out the excesses via bankruptcy. 

 

However, the COVID-19 pandemic layers on an added and unique issue.  In the absence of some sort of paycheck (fiscal stimulus) coming from the guarantor of last resort (e.g. the Federal Gov), one of two things will happen:

1. People are not going to stay home because they need $$$ to put food on the table, and this pandemic will be far worse.  And it will crush our hospital system, leading to additional mortality from other treatable illnesses that can't find space/time at the hospital. 

2. People will stay home, businesses will go bankrupt in a truly large scale (taking CRE with it), and we will end up with a depression that takes decades to dig out of. 

 

The idea of fiscal stimulus, and monetary stimulus, bothers me - I don't like it for a lot of reasons.  But if some fiscal stimulus is needed, I'd much rather see that go directly into the pockets of a waitress trying to make ends meet, rather than a financial institution via a bail-out. 

 

And in this crisis, it is time to "Go Big or Go Home" with the fiscal stimulus.  Trump missed the boat to manage this crisis 2 months ago, and with every passing day, the cost of mitigation grows ever larger.

 

I think the reason that this will be worse than a run of the mill recession is due to previous coddling. Look at what the market did during the Spanish flu issue. Not this.

 

The market traded at <6x earnings at the start of Spanish Flu. Glad you did your research

[tede02]

Romney must be reading the message board  ;)

 

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/03/16/coronavirus-stimulus-romney-proposes-1000-for-every-american.html

[Guest]

The government should come out and send checks to everyone ( at least low wage / gig workers / need based ) . After all that’s what they are doing for the rich people who own assets in terms of QE and lowering interest rates.

 

Small businesses and honest hard working people who serve the community and are not able to do so now because of an act of god shouldn’t suffer

 

Or the government should stop coddling everyone and let reality play out the way it should?

 

If this was a run-of-the-mill recession, then I would agree with your mentality/statement.  We should let the market wring out the excesses via bankruptcy. 

 

However, the COVID-19 pandemic layers on an added and unique issue.  In the absence of some sort of paycheck (fiscal stimulus) coming from the guarantor of last resort (e.g. the Federal Gov), one of two things will happen:

1. People are not going to stay home because they need $$$ to put food on the table, and this pandemic will be far worse.  And it will crush our hospital system, leading to additional mortality from other treatable illnesses that can't find space/time at the hospital. 

2. People will stay home, businesses will go bankrupt in a truly large scale (taking CRE with it), and we will end up with a depression that takes decades to dig out of. 

 

The idea of fiscal stimulus, and monetary stimulus, bothers me - I don't like it for a lot of reasons.  But if some fiscal stimulus is needed, I'd much rather see that go directly into the pockets of a waitress trying to make ends meet, rather than a financial institution via a bail-out. 

 

And in this crisis, it is time to "Go Big or Go Home" with the fiscal stimulus.  Trump missed the boat to manage this crisis 2 months ago, and with every passing day, the cost of mitigation grows ever larger.

 

I think the reason that this will be worse than a run of the mill recession is due to previous coddling. Look at what the market did during the Spanish flu issue. Not this.

 

The market traded at <6x earnings at the start of Spanish Flu. Glad you did your research

 

Do you think the the market would be trading at current p/e if not for government coddling?

[Guest]

Romney must be reading the message board  ;)

 

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/03/16/coronavirus-stimulus-romney-proposes-1000-for-every-american.html

 

Bush tried almost the same thing with the Economic Stimulus Act of 2008.

[chrispy]

What happens to the global economy if in 4 weeks we see light at the end of the tunnel with this infection and Russia/Saudi come to a deal?

[rb]

Romney must be reading the message board  ;)

 

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/03/16/coronavirus-stimulus-romney-proposes-1000-for-every-american.html

I hope that guy paid his 20 bucks!