Is Elon Musk stupid or just trying to screw over Tesla shareholders?

[Valuebets]

Is Elon Musk stupid or just trying to screw Tesla shareholders?

 

How would Mr. Musk react if Tesla's EV technological and brand lead faded? If sales were falling? If huge established OEM were reducing the EV gap with the pionner you own and founded?

 

I mean, people think Musk is a genius? Maybe he is (he certainly has no empathy, and think aboit its own interest first, second, third, etc) How about he sees Tesla sales falling, long before he gets into politics... and he gets so intense with Republicans, that now he can pretend its the cause of Tesla's problems, or upcoming market shares and margins issues.

 

When people, shareholders, activists, bounce around the idea that Tesla might be better off, in countries around the world, with consumers, if he wasn't the owner and if his personnal projets, MAGA for instance, something he is "genuinely" doing for the "greater good" of America (which i dont think he cares about at all)... Nobody would bring the idea to buyback Musk? Or similars projects resulting in Musk cashing real $ for shares he can’t sale easily.

 

That is a crazy master plan, but how can you dump Tesla shares when everyone is watching what you are doing, looking for signs. What is better than being told to back off and accept 75 cents for $1 at the current market price? I'm sure he'd laugh if he could sell everything at a discount.

If its not the plan, why would the richest man, depending on public acceptance, insult countries, end markets, get into domestic politics, but also international politics. Its either a kamekaze, or a wise man selling his dam Tesla shares to get $.

 

Interested in your opinion

Edited yesterday at 02:28 AM by Valuebets

[Gamecock-YT]

4 hours ago, Valuebets said:

 

 

Interested in your opinion

 

I don't care to have one

[Charlie]

Munger at the DJCO annual meeting in 2014 about Elon Musk:

"I think Elon Musk is a genius and I don´t use that word lightly. I think he´s also one of the boldest men that ever came down the pike.

Put me down as saying I´ve always been afraid of the guy whose IQ is 190 and he thinks it´s 250. I like to think there´s a little of that

risk with Elon. He´s a certified genius."

 

This sums it up pretty well. 

Edited yesterday at 07:59 AM by Charlie

[adventurer]

2 hours ago, Charlie said:

Munger at the DJCO annual meeting in 2014 about Elon Musk:

"I think Elon Musk is a genius and I don´t use that word lightly. I think he´s also one of the boldest men that ever came down the pike.

Put me down as saying I´ve always been afraid of the guy whose IQ is 190 and he thinks it´s 250. I like to think there´s a little of that

risk with Elon. He´s a certified genius."

 

This sums it up pretty well. 

+1

Adding Munger`s remark to never underestimate a man that overestimates himself. Considering all the arbitrariness that goes on with Tesla stock I don`t understand how anyone can consider this to be a good investment by now. This is even hardly a good speculation anymore (depending on the context of course) but just gambling. Look at the change in price within just a few months since the election. Fundamentals can`t change that fast or at least did not change that fast for Tesla. Everyone I know that is talking about Tesla stock has no idea of their fundamentals nor do they have a solid understanding of what investing is at all (meaning they have no proper definition at hand). 

 

The world is going crazy. Dogmatism is the safest way to fanaticism. 

 

Edit:

Look up the story about the YouTuber Asmongold and Elon Musk on YouTube or Wikipedia. Elon Musk shouts his insecurity into the world. 

Edited yesterday at 10:02 AM by adventurer

[Gregmal]

Elon Musk has probably made more money for shareholders in his ventures than anyone on Earth. That by itself, buys quite a bit of credibility. Somebody whom was skeptical of him doing so along the way still being skeptical isn't going to change that. 

[james22]

3 hours ago, Gregmal said:

Somebody whom was skeptical of him doing so along the way still being skeptical isn't going to change that. 

 

And someone who is skeptical only since his political conversion has zero credibility.

 

Nuke this thread already.

[cubsfan]

12 hours ago, Valuebets said:

Is Elon Musk stupid or just trying to screw Tesla shareholders?

 

How would Mr. Musk react if Tesla's EV technological and brand lead faded? If sales were falling? If huge established OEM were reducing the EV gap with the pionner you own and founded?

 

I mean, people think Musk is a genius? Maybe he is (he certainly has no empathy, and think aboit its own interest first, second, third, etc) How about he sees Tesla sales falling, long before he gets into politics... and he gets so intense with Republicans, that now he can pretend its the cause of Tesla's problems, or upcoming market shares and margins issues.

 

When people, shareholders, activists, bounce around the idea that Tesla might be better off, in countries around the world, with consumers, if he wasn't the owner and if his personnal projets, MAGA for instance, something he is "genuinely" doing for the "greater good" of America (which i dont think he cares about at all)... Nobody would bring the idea to buyback Musk? Or similars projects resulting in Musk cashing real $ for shares he can’t sale easily.

 

That is a crazy master plan, but how can you dump Tesla shares when everyone is watching what you are doing, looking for signs. What is better than being told to back off and accept 75 cents for $1 at the current market price? I'm sure he'd laugh if he could sell everything at a discount.

If its not the plan, why would the richest man, depending on public acceptance, insult countries, end markets, get into domestic politics, but also international politics. Its either a kamekaze, or a wise man selling his dam Tesla shares to get $.

 

Interested in your opinion

 

You seem to deliberately avoid the obvious explanation:

 

Mr. Musk loves America, has made plenty of money - and with few things left to do - has decided to pay the country back in a big, big way for a country that has given him so much good fortune.

 

That is not difficult to figure out.

[Malmqky]

On one hand he’s doing God’s work with DOGE.

 

On the other hand, I think he’s a narcissist who craves power and is going to deregulate/destabilize with the goal of increasing his own wealth. I don’t believe for a second he’s doing this because he “loves America” or wants to “give back”.

 

We’ll see how this ends. Done commenting because I don’t want a 30 day ban.

 

Edit: he’s created lots of wealth for shareholders at the end of the day. Results count for something.

Edited yesterday at 03:51 PM by Malmqky

[73 Reds]

5 minutes ago, Malmqky said:

On one hand he’s doing God’s work with DOGE.

 

On the other hand, I think he’s a narcissist who craves power and is going to deregulate/destabilize with the goal of increasing his own wealth. I don’t believe for a second he’s doing this because he “loves America” or wants to “give back”.

 

We’ll see how this ends. Done commenting because I don’t want a 30 day ban.

 

Edit: he’s created lots of wealth for shareholders at the end of the day. Results count for something.

I think folks throw around the word "narcissist" all too often and don't even understand its consequences.  In a business sense, there is nothing wrong with narcissism if it gives you an edge and shareholders can come along for the ride.

[Malmqky]

2 minutes ago, 73 Reds said:

I think folks throw around the word "narcissist" all too often and don't even understand its consequences.  In a business sense, there is nothing wrong with narcissism if it gives you an edge and shareholders can come along for the ride.

Agreed.

 

But I think he’s certainly one, it makes me doubt his motives (DOGE).

 

Okay, done commenting for real.

[73 Reds]

1 hour ago, Malmqky said:

Agreed.

 

But I think he’s certainly one, it makes me doubt his motives (DOGE).

 

Okay, done commenting for real.

OK.  Not sure I understand the distinction from simply being highly confident in one's abilities.   Which is not necessarily bad for DOGE.

[dwy000]

There's no questioning Musks achievements. None.  The issue I have is with the Tesla board. First, if your CEO is also CEO of 4-5 other companies is that really in the best interest of shareholders?  And second, there's really no debating that his antics over the past 18 months have harmed Teslas reputation and sales.  At what point do you uphold your fiduciary obligation to shareholders and say that you need to put someone else as the head and let Elon go off and do his political thing?  

[Xerxes]

Is this a political thread in disguise 

 

we do already have a DOGE thread, a Tesla thread etc even a SpaceX thread 

[73 Reds]

Nah, I think @dwy000 makes a good point.  The issue is not so much about Elon and Tesla but rather when does any CEO spread himself too thin?  I view this similar to investing in a family controlled business.  BODs have very little persuasion over "the Boss".  You take the bad with the good and when the two get misaligned, you cut bait.   

[james22]

 

[james22]

 

[Grenville]

5 hours ago, cubsfan said:

 

You seem to deliberately avoid the obvious explanation:

 

Mr. Musk loves America, has made plenty of money - and with few things left to do - has decided to pay the country back in a big, big way for a country that has given him so much good fortune.

 

That is not difficult to figure out.

 

he doesn’t love America. He loves his goal of getting to Mars and his ego. Everything else he does is in service of that. 

[james22]

So many psychologists.

 

Who knew?

[winjitsu]

13 hours ago, dwy000 said:

There's no questioning Musks achievements. None.  The issue I have is with the Tesla board. First, if your CEO is also CEO of 4-5 other companies is that really in the best interest of shareholders?  And second, there's really no debating that his antics over the past 18 months have harmed Teslas reputation and sales.  At what point do you uphold your fiduciary obligation to shareholders and say that you need to put someone else as the head and let Elon go off and do his political thing?  

 

Someone else is in charge for all his other companies running day to day. I'm not sure it makes a difference if his title were ultimately changed to Chairman instead of CEO, people would still love or hate the stock by his ownership and association.

[dwy000]

7 hours ago, winjitsu said:

 

Someone else is in charge for all his other companies running day to day. I'm not sure it makes a difference if his title were ultimately changed to Chairman instead of CEO, people would still love or hate the stock by his ownership and association.

He's getting paid by Tesla shareholders like he's making each car personally. If he's not involved in running day to day operations this should be reflected in the governance. 

[james22]

Sell your shares, dwy000.