wachtwoord Posted March 1, 2018 Share Posted March 1, 2018 As I keep saying she's asking the wrong question (s) and focusing on the wrong part of the answers. I mean the article I cite even answers that question. But don't invest in things you don't understand. Her questions shows she does not (and is not closer or on any sort of track) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurgis Posted March 7, 2018 Share Posted March 7, 2018 Bitcoin is better than sex: https://www.nytimes.com/2018/02/28/business/economy/bitcoin-electricity-productivity.html 8) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DRValue Posted March 7, 2018 Share Posted March 7, 2018 Did a search for Chainlink and it came up blank... Has anyone mentioned Chainlink yet? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liberty Posted March 14, 2018 Share Posted March 14, 2018 Sorry for bumping up this thread since it's the first time it's been falling off the page (I wonder what that means), but I thought this news we worth it: https://www.cnbc.com/2018/03/13/google-bans-crypto-ads.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnarkyPuppy Posted March 14, 2018 Share Posted March 14, 2018 Sorry for bumping up this thread since it's the first time it's been falling off the page (I wonder what that means), but I thought this news we worth it: https://www.cnbc.com/2018/03/13/google-bans-crypto-ads.html "(I wonder what that means"- value investing is the discipline of removing price/enthusiasm (december spike) from underlying fundamentals (censorship resistant store of value) and evaluating the spread. Nothing has changed. Maybe the optimism of those who watch CNBC? I would invert the google ban. Maybe it's a problem that centrally owned corporations can censor ads based on opinion? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wachtwoord Posted March 14, 2018 Share Posted March 14, 2018 Why do you think that's interesting news? Boring as hell and a complete non-event (wrt Bitcoin that is. I'm sure this sucks for scammers out there). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rkbabang Posted March 14, 2018 Author Share Posted March 14, 2018 Why do you think that's interesting news? Boring as hell and a complete non-event (wrt Bitcoin that is. I'm sure this sucks for scammers out there). +1 The Bitcoin Genius is out of a job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liberty Posted March 14, 2018 Share Posted March 14, 2018 Why do you think that's interesting news? Boring as hell and a complete non-event (wrt Bitcoin that is. I'm sure this sucks for scammers out there). With the sheer amount of fraud going on in the space, this is certainly not a non-event. It also reduces the supply of new patsies to the ecosystem, which is bound to affect the supply/demand equilibrium. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wachtwoord Posted March 14, 2018 Share Posted March 14, 2018 You are very wrong. Complete non-event on everything legitimate. Rest is not relevant anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liberty Posted March 14, 2018 Share Posted March 14, 2018 You are very wrong. Complete non-event on everything legitimate. Rest is not relevant anyway. Not relevant to you, which is fine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rkbabang Posted March 14, 2018 Author Share Posted March 14, 2018 You are very wrong. Complete non-event on everything legitimate. Rest is not relevant anyway. Not relevant to you, which is fine. How long does someone taken in by a bitcoin scam hold bitcoin? The only thing this might do, if anything, is dampen some of the wild swings as Mr or Mrs gullible fall for bitcoin Genius ads, buy bitcoin after spending $200 on a newsletter that they didn't need, then panic and sell at the first drop in price. It has no effect on whatever long term value bitcoin has or doesn't have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SharperDingaan Posted March 14, 2018 Share Posted March 14, 2018 Key word here is legitimate. If your value proposition is 'real', Googles banning may cause some short-term disruption but truly is a non-event. Google will also have the benefit of Facebooks experience, and will be able to more precisely target the ban. Overall most would expect an aggregate drop in total demand, lowering the prices of all altcoin and token. Bitcoin being hedgeable, likely suffering the smallest decline. Not a bad thing. SD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liberty Posted March 14, 2018 Share Posted March 14, 2018 You are very wrong. Complete non-event on everything legitimate. Rest is not relevant anyway. Not relevant to you, which is fine. How long does someone taken in by a bitcoin scam hold bitcoin? The only thing this might do, if anything, is dampen some of the wild swings as Mr or Mrs gullible fall for bitcoin Genius ads, buy bitcoin after spending $200 on a newsletter that they didn't need, then panic and sell at the first drop in price. It has no effect on whatever long term value bitcoin has or doesn't have. It might or might not have long term impact on the value of cryptocurrencies (I never mentioned Bitcoin specifically, this is a thread about cryptocurrencies in general). ICOs that used ETH certainly had an impact on demand for it, and if fewer ICOs can easily raise money, it certainly changes the dynamic for the number of projects and people working on them. Sure the worse projects will be hit first, as it should be, but it's still an ecosystem that is interconnected. I don't know what the impact will be, but having both FB and GOOG off limits to market ICOs certainly isn't nothing. But in any case, my interest in the news was mostly related to the societal harm caused by all these scams and frauds. Making it harder for them to reach victims is a good thing, and worth noting. The world wouldn't be a better place if securities were unregulated and sophisticated marketing operations could say anything to convince your grandma to empty out her retirement account. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rkbabang Posted March 14, 2018 Author Share Posted March 14, 2018 You are very wrong. Complete non-event on everything legitimate. Rest is not relevant anyway. Not relevant to you, which is fine. How long does someone taken in by a bitcoin scam hold bitcoin? The only thing this might do, if anything, is dampen some of the wild swings as Mr or Mrs gullible fall for bitcoin Genius ads, buy bitcoin after spending $200 on a newsletter that they didn't need, then panic and sell at the first drop in price. It has no effect on whatever long term value bitcoin has or doesn't have. It might or might not have long term impact on the value of cryptocurrencies (I never mentioned Bitcoin specifically, this is a thread about cryptocurrencies in general). ICOs that used ETH certainly had an impact on demand for it, and if fewer ICOs can easily raise money, it certainly changes the dynamic for the number of projects and people working on them. Sure the worse projects will be hit first, as it should be, but it's still an ecosystem that is interconnected. I don't know what the impact will be, but having both FB and GOOG off limits to market ICOs certainly isn't nothing. But in any case, my interest in the news was mostly related to the societal harm caused by all these scams and frauds. Making it harder for them to reach victims is a good thing, and worth noting. The world wouldn't be a better place if securities were unregulated and sophisticated marketing operations could say anything to convince your grandma to empty out her retirement account. The difference here is that FB and Google are not being forced to do this. Instead of blindly following some law written by elected morons, they will work to get it right to satisfy their users. If they decide to eventually let some ads through and not others based on metrics they come up with they can still do that. When something is regulated from on high in broad strokes, it is always one size fits all and followed to the letter regardless of how absurd it makes some individual cases. I have no problem with Google trying to block their users from a bunch of scammers. One of Google's strengths is the usefulness of the ads they show you, but if those ads are scams that isn't useful to anyone but the scammer. If people stop trusting the ads they see on google, the company is in trouble. Unlike a politician looking for a sound byte ("I passed the grandma protection act..."), Google has every incentive to get it right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wachtwoord Posted March 14, 2018 Share Posted March 14, 2018 Precisely Liberty, the thread is about crypto currencies. The vast majority of ICOs are NOT cryptocurrencies. Another example of a large digital asset which is not a cryptocurrency is Ripple. The major cryptocurrencies such as Bitcoin, Litecoin and Monero are completely unaffected by this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liberty Posted March 14, 2018 Share Posted March 14, 2018 Precisely Liberty, the thread is about crypto currencies. The vast majority of ICOs are NOT cryptocurrencies. Another example of a large digital asset which is not a cryptocurrency is Ripple. The major cryptocurrencies such as Bitcoin, Litecoin and Monero are completely unaffected by this. The term is also an umbrella term used for the sector, so please no need to get pedantic. There's all kinds of discussion in this thread, and I wasn't about to create a new one just for tokens or whatever. How do people pay for ICOs anyway? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
siddharth18 Posted March 17, 2018 Share Posted March 17, 2018 https://medium.com/@zemacedo/blockchain-value-investment-opportunity-rialto-8c8f8d4adf17 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnarkyPuppy Posted March 18, 2018 Share Posted March 18, 2018 Etheriums network creates users for Ether; the bigger the network, the more demand for Ether. A company uses the Etherium network because it wants to use its tools to build and test out its own smart-contract blockchain applications. Once the concept has been proved with a working application, they decide their next steps. Hence Etherium is essentially an agile project management facility that allows participants to test - without having to first risk a fortune on an uncertain IT setup. A very attractive value proposition. A CBDC is just a 'digital dollar' - a CB creates/runs it; but anyone can use it, the same as anyone can use a 'paper' dollar. Most altcoin is created to pay for transactions within a specified group of users; 'cause by accepting 'this' altcoin, we can sell a ton of it today and use the proceeds to collectively develop the business (essentially seignorage). But if I can pay with a CBDC the recipient can spend that CBDC anywhere; if I pay with Altcoin the recipient can only use it within the group of users. Hence if the user groups business is fairing poorer than the economy overall (most cases), the last thing a recipient wants is this restrictive altcoin. The altcoin 'devalues' relative to CBDC, and gets their via a 'price' collapse. SD I agree with you from the perspective of Ethereum being a utility for smart contract execution (i.e. a cheap agile UAT interface as you describe it). I have no conviction on Ethereum. Think it's possible the platform itself plays out in a bullish way with the coin itself being worth next to nothing (marginal utility cost for smart contract execution as described in the whitepaper wachtwoord posted a while back). But can you answer this question from the perspective of a cryptocurrency being valuable as a judgment and censorship resistant store of value? The value proposition is quite literally tied to the fact that it is completely removed from government decision making. Surely this is a strong counterargument against governemnt issued cryptocurrencies? I'm actually confused that the store of value thesis doesn't click with more people. Peter Thiel basically articulates the bull thesis as we have at 36min. Just seems incredibly +expected value right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SharperDingaan Posted March 18, 2018 Share Posted March 18, 2018 Etheriums network creates users for Ether; the bigger the network, the more demand for Ether. A company uses the Etherium network because it wants to use its tools to build and test out its own smart-contract blockchain applications. Once the concept has been proved with a working application, they decide their next steps. Hence Etherium is essentially an agile project management facility that allows participants to test - without having to first risk a fortune on an uncertain IT setup. A very attractive value proposition. A CBDC is just a 'digital dollar' - a CB creates/runs it; but anyone can use it, the same as anyone can use a 'paper' dollar. Most altcoin is created to pay for transactions within a specified group of users; 'cause by accepting 'this' altcoin, we can sell a ton of it today and use the proceeds to collectively develop the business (essentially seignorage). But if I can pay with a CBDC the recipient can spend that CBDC anywhere; if I pay with Altcoin the recipient can only use it within the group of users. Hence if the user groups business is fairing poorer than the economy overall (most cases), the last thing a recipient wants is this restrictive altcoin. The altcoin 'devalues' relative to CBDC, and gets their via a 'price' collapse. SD I agree with you from the perspective of Ethereum being a utility for smart contract execution (i.e. a cheap agile UAT interface as you describe it). I have no conviction on Ethereum. Think it's possible the platform itself plays out in a bullish way with the coin itself being worth next to nothing (marginal utility cost for smart contract execution as described in the whitepaper wachtwoord posted a while back). But can you answer this question from the perspective of a cryptocurrency being valuable as a judgment and censorship resistant store of value? The value proposition is quite literally tied to the fact that it is completely removed from government decision making. Surely this is a strong counterargument against governemnt issued cryptocurrencies? I'm actually confused that the store of value thesis doesn't click with more people. Peter Thiel basically articulates the bull thesis as we have at 36min. Just seems incredibly +expected value right now. If you want a judgement and censor resistant store of value, your clear choice is Bitcoin. It was designed for zero trust environments, and is the only cryptocoin with a futures/options market - thus allowing the holder to control price risk; and therefore very valuable. Problem is that you're rubbing shoulders with the criminal element, 'cause the same things you want are as equally valuable to them. Ulltimately 'value' is determined by the users purpose for holding Bitcoin. 'Money/inflation/store of value' has always been difficult for people to get their heads around. The 'collective' also behaves very differently from individuals, and adapts to change much more slowly. The thesis doesn't click because it doesn't have sufficient critical mass yet (Gladwell's tipping point). In value investment we typically refer to it as being 'too early', and it means just that. The thesis itself may well be bang on, and perfectly sound. SD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liberty Posted April 6, 2018 Share Posted April 6, 2018 McAfee's million dollar prediction goes wrong https://fnordprefect.de/ I am surprised that anyone even listens to him Payola: https://www.theverge.com/2018/4/2/17189880/john-mcafee-bitcoin-cryptocurrency-twitter-ico Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rkbabang Posted April 6, 2018 Author Share Posted April 6, 2018 Funny now that they are on sale there isn't a lot of people asking which ones to buy now here lately. I bought more Bitcoin yesterday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SharperDingaan Posted April 6, 2018 Share Posted April 6, 2018 Funny now that they are on sale there isn't a lot of people asking which ones to buy now here lately. I bought more Bitcoin yesterday. Not to argue that merits of technical analysis, but you might want look at a BTC chart. Alternatively, build your own if you also want RSI and moving averages. SD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnarkyPuppy Posted April 6, 2018 Share Posted April 6, 2018 Funny now that they are on sale there isn't a lot of people asking which ones to buy now here lately. I bought more Bitcoin yesterday. I have a full position and dollar cost average incrementally every 2 weeks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wachtwoord Posted April 6, 2018 Share Posted April 6, 2018 Funny now that they are on sale there isn't a lot of people asking which ones to buy now here lately. I bought more Bitcoin yesterday. Not to argue that merits of technical analysis, but you might want look at a BTC chart. Alternatively, build your own if you also want RSI and moving averages. SD Technical analysis on a value investing board? Mayorly undervalued is mayorly undervalued. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SharperDingaan Posted April 6, 2018 Share Posted April 6, 2018 Funny now that they are on sale there isn't a lot of people asking which ones to buy now here lately. I bought more Bitcoin yesterday. Not to argue that merits of technical analysis, but you might want look at a BTC chart. Alternatively, build your own if you also want RSI and moving averages. SD Technical analysis on a value investing board? Mayorly undervalued is mayorly undervalued. Just mindful that the current price is below the last trough low (Feb-05) of USD 6,914. For those who belive in the voodoo science, this supposedly means that at the curent price of USD 6,611 it could drop quick a bit until it 'finds' a new level. And given that there really isn't any agreed fundamental value approach applicable to Bitcoin - tossing bones may well be as good as it gets! No opinion as to whether it is under or overvalued. ;D SD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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