Sweet

For arguments sake let’s say you are right for right now. They are (well were) committed to those meeting those values. There were a range of criteria which they’d have to meet to get entry to the EU and NATO which they’d sought.

I think the distinctions matter. But at least that’s an answer.

Nah… you’ll find it hard to find anyone more right-wing than me. This one isn't the usual left vs right crap. Trump and Russian collusion, never believed it. Biden laptop, never believed it. Covid couldn’t be lab based - never believed it. This is not like the others. You and others, to be kind, clearly were never interested in this topic until quite recently - and you can tell because it Russian talking points easily dredged up on Twitter which you are posting. Look, I’m not saying Russia doesn’t have a point. I’m not saying Russia should be ignored, they cannot. I’m not saying there are no counter narratives. I am saying you are too quick to generalise that this is like all those other events because so and so said x,y and z. I don’t get that.

Funny. Al-qaeda was not communist though. Originally to fight communism sure, but it wasn’t mentioned, the charter was about democracy and liberty. It was Vance, just a couple of weeks ago who said (correctly) in a speech in Europe, that we have to know what we are fighting for. NATO was for democracy and liberty, not specifically against communism.

That’s an answer to a different question. I’m not talking about Ukrainians vs Russians as people. But the type of government, the leadership, and the values they have. I feel like the answer is kind of obvious and it’s strange you haven’t given a straight answer.

Yeh, Afghanistan and democracy was a road to a hiding. That was dumb. Ukraine is an imperfect democracy but its people are largely agree that’s what they want. One last point on Afghanistan. Lots of talk about NATO recently and how useless it has been recently. Article 5 was only invoked once, by the US after 9/11. It was NATO that invaded Afghanistan, not just the US. About 30% of combined forces were non US. Over 500 British died, 2,500 seriously injured, because America asked for help and got it. I think it’s a mistake to throw that away.

Regarding innocents - sure. Regarding ‘good’ - you think Ukraine, its aspirations, values and its leaders aren’t any better than Russia / Putin?

That’s totally not how Trump negotiates lol.

Are you talking about the war, of the disposition of the Ukrainian government in 2014? I think I’m misreading you, so trying to understand.

You guys don’t seem to know this is common knowledge lol. If you did you would be capable of reading my comment correctly rather than from ignorance.

Nobody said the US didn’t interfere Greg, read the room. You’d think you stop it with the self-owning by now. The Nuland phone conversation is widely known and often the only thing brought up when interference is mentioned. What I’m saying is that Russia interfered, yet that’s rarely brought up, and there’s rarely any outrage about it. Hence the ‘American bad’ (when it does it) ‘Russia good’ (when it does it). I’m also saying that US interference alone did not topple the government, it was a populist movement of Ukrainians. Thus the paid actors comment. The US can poke its nose in all it wants, but if it wasn’t for the hundreds of thousands of Ukrainians on the street then the government would not have been disposed.

When you say 33% of your net assets, does that include the house you are currently in? I don’t think that number is high btw. For many people their home is their only asset, and they only own a part of it.

Makes sense John. I wonder how Trump views his interventions. I can only guess.

Yanukovych was overthrown by his own people James. You think the 800,000 (peak) who occupied Kyiv were paid up actors by the Americans lol? Yanukovych failed to sign a trade association with the EU under pressure from Russia against the will of his own people and parliament: https://www.kyivpost.com/post/6963 Does it not matter that he defied his own people and parliament? Does it not matter than it was Russian meddling that torpedoed that agreement and sparked the civil unrest? Do you even know this or do you simply not care because ‘American bad Russia good’?

What are you seeing John which you don’t like and which I may have missed?

This was much better than I expected. But this was not the JD Vance in the Oval Office who lost his cool.

I was not aware of this, thanks for posting. I need to read more about it.

It's ironic. My post history in this thread is that Europe has been nearly uninvestable - I am exaggerating slightly but it has been bad recently. I have always preferred US stocks and markets for that reason, it's just the best. And yet, some of the policies and tariff proposals etc is making me think that for the next four years at least, the US market could be hard and it is making Europe look a bit better. They still need to kill a lot of regulation and policies, but some of the political changes afoot could be good for European stocks and the economy in general.

Exactly. Zelenskyy is in a terrible spot, it was terrible even before Trump. But apparently he just wants to be famous and keep the war going lol.

Yeh, I agree there is a comparison there, and I understand the Russians are pissed. It is a fact that NATO has expanded to Russian borders, but it also bordered the Soviet Union too. I would disagree that US 'made' NATO expand. That's not really how it works, countries apply to NATO, and then NATO votes on whether that country should join and that vote needs to be unanimous I believe. The US can nudge countries yeh, but I don't recall that it has ever forced anyone to sign up.

Maybe some do but I think that is unlikely. When the counteroffensive last year amounted to nothing the war was pretty much stalemated. My reading, which could be wrong, is that really the only thing Ukraine wants is some kind of guarantee that if they sign a peace deal that it won’t be broken. I think they’d eat every other compromise.

I mean, that’s fair. America cannot be the world’s policeman. And I’ve said repeatedly in this thread that fundamentally this is Europe’s problem and Europe’s failure and they have taken American money and friendship for granted. Where I have a slight disagreement with you is that you don’t seem to believe Western values are worth promoting or defending. You obviously benefit from these values by living in the US but you don’t seem to have much empathy for those who also want to live like you. If I am wrong correct me.

Is he winning the optics war? Maybe with particular, and important audience, the MAGA crowd. Outside that, in the rest of the world, I don’t see any change. In fact I see the opposite. Zelenskyy is trying to get some kind of security guarantee with peace, if we were in his shoes we would probably want the same.

And yours is a classic text book butt-hurt response Greg. You are in fact regurgitating Russian talking points and your feet stamping doesn’t change that. Yesterday your referred to Ukraine as sliver of ‘old-Russia’. You effectively said Zelenskyy doesn’t want peace because he liked to be famous lol. You know who else says these things? Russia. When forming an opinion it’s our job to figure out what is propaganda and what’s not and you seem unable to do that.

yep. Not sure how they get security guarantees to be honest. I think Russia looks likely to get what it wants. You know a lot about stocks Greg, but my god, you do gurgle so much shit from Putin’s ass. And the thing is you don’t even seem to be aware you are doing it lol. Nothing above is close to being a fact, it’s random ideas in your head that you think sound smart. Sorry, I know that’s blunt, bordering even rude of me, but for someone clearly as intelligent as you it’s so out of character.