Packer16 Posted February 26, 2017 Share Posted February 26, 2017 I agree that the press has the freedom but the President also has the freedom to defend himself. This is just an extension of what Obama did to the Supreme Court justices. In the end the voters will determine who they listen to & believe. One fact I did not realize is the amounts Dems pay per vote is almost 2:1 versus the Repubs, this is for the last 4 Presidential elections. This may be an economic reason why the press has so slowly changed to be balanced. It also has some interesting investing implications for the next 4 years as the media machine is ramped up. Packer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anony208 Posted February 27, 2017 Share Posted February 27, 2017 Personally I don't care where Obama was born. Sure, there's the constitutional issue but that'll be changed one day as it really shouldn't be a qualification. You shouldn't need to be born here to become our best leader. In Obama's case, even if he were born elsewhere, if our presidents primary job is to represent our country I think he did a bang up job, and voted twice for him for that alone. That said, what he actually accomplished he can go to hell for. But I wouldn't call the birthers crazy either. There are plenty of issues with both Obama's birth certificate and college record that he could have been more forthright with them. It took him years to share his birth certificate, and that thing is sketchy as hell, and to this day he has refused to share his college record. Given that and all the suspicions, I'd take terrible odds on a bet that he actually isn't a US citizen. But again, that doesn't matter to me. Note: if you're curious why I would vote twice for a guy based only on the way he carried himself, even though I detested what he was actually doing, pre-Trump they all sucked beans. I felt, what the hell, Romney will be as bad anyway. They all lied, they all bullshitted, not an iota of their public appearance was ever real. They did what their party's and pac's told them to do, America be damned. Between Reagan to Trump the swamp had become so bad no one cared about voting anymore. I still vote. I don't know why because it's become a circus, but i do. Edit: MAGA The Hawaii Sec of State I believe stated that Obama's birth cert was genuine. I am interested in hearing your explanation on why the SOS would be ready to take a bullet(in case it was proven that the cert was false). Also Trump announced that his investigators in HI were finding incredible and unbelievable things. 5+ years later we still wait for those findings. The incredible BS spouting king that this Orange Julius is, I would not be surprised if there never were any investigators in the first place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Desert_Rat Posted February 27, 2017 Share Posted February 27, 2017 Deference to the pres? who knows, I do not care. I was just pointing out that those crazy people have a leg to stand on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rb Posted February 27, 2017 Share Posted February 27, 2017 But I wouldn't call the birthers crazy either. There are plenty of issues with both Obama's birth certificate and college record that he could have been more forthright with them. It took him years to share his birth certificate, and that thing is sketchy as hell, and to this day he has refused to share his college record. Given that and all the suspicions, I'd take terrible odds on a bet that he actually isn't a US citizen. But again, that doesn't matter to me. Note: if you're curious why I would vote twice for a guy based only on the way he carried himself, even though I detested what he was actually doing, pre-Trump they all sucked beans. I felt, what the hell, Romney will be as bad anyway. They all lied, they all bullshitted, not an iota of their public appearance was ever real. They did what their party's and pac's told them to do, America be damned. Between Reagan to Trump the swamp had become so bad no one cared about voting anymore. Wow, you really love disclosure and transparency right. There are still questions about the birth certificate? I guess you guys aren't satisfied until Obama shows up and presents it to you personally. Then it's onto college records. You really like presidents to be really forthright with those things. In the same spirit I suspect that you are OUTRAGED by Trump's refusal to release his tax returns, never mind his college records. As for lies and bullshit you've gotta be kidding me. The Trump Administration lies like crazy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Desert_Rat Posted February 27, 2017 Share Posted February 27, 2017 I am disappointed that any one on this site would lack the fundamental knowledge of a tax return. I should ignore the comment as leftist hate instead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rb Posted February 27, 2017 Share Posted February 27, 2017 I am disappointed that any one on this site would lack the fundamental knowledge of a tax return. I should ignore the comment as leftist hate instead. So expecting Donald Trump to follow more than 4 decades of precedent on information disclosure for the office of President is leftist hate. But thinking that Obama's refusal to release his college records (for which there isn't such expectation) is sketchy is totally reasonable. I see your logic there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peregrine Posted February 27, 2017 Share Posted February 27, 2017 Personally I don't care where Obama was born. Sure, there's the constitutional issue but that'll be changed one day as it really shouldn't be a qualification. You shouldn't need to be born here to become our best leader. In Obama's case, even if he were born elsewhere, if our presidents primary job is to represent our country I think he did a bang up job, and voted twice for him for that alone. That said, what he actually accomplished he can go to hell for. But I wouldn't call the birthers crazy either. There are plenty of issues with both Obama's birth certificate and college record that he could have been more forthright with them. It took him years to share his birth certificate, and that thing is sketchy as hell, and to this day he has refused to share his college record. Given that and all the suspicions, I'd take terrible odds on a bet that he actually isn't a US citizen. But again, that doesn't matter to me. Note: if you're curious why I would vote twice for a guy based only on the way he carried himself, even though I detested what he was actually doing, pre-Trump they all sucked beans. I felt, what the hell, Romney will be as bad anyway. They all lied, they all bullshitted, not an iota of their public appearance was ever real. They did what their party's and pac's told them to do, America be damned. Between Reagan to Trump the swamp had become so bad no one cared about voting anymore. I still vote. I don't know why because it's become a circus, but i do. Edit: MAGA Lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeffmori7 Posted February 27, 2017 Author Share Posted February 27, 2017 So maybe it is not a banana republic after all...it is at least more modern... https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/feb/26/robert-mercer-breitbart-war-on-media-steve-bannon-donald-trump-nigel-farage Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hawks Posted February 28, 2017 Share Posted February 28, 2017 Your President Trump is starting to sound like a "broken record". This morning I read he said his current troubles, the leaks and protests are due to Obama. Why doesn't the President of the U.S. take some responsibility for his own actions? He blames others all the time. Our parents raised us to take responsibility for our own actions; surely the leader of a western nation should take some responsibility when the going gets tough. But not him. On another topic, Buffett has said there is no problem releasing one's tax returns when an audit is being conducted. Why does Trump continue to deny releasing them? The more he is in denial, the more one suspects there is something there he doesn't want public. Perhaps the Senate Intelligence Committee will take a look see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cardboard Posted February 28, 2017 Share Posted February 28, 2017 By "broken record" do you mean that Obama did the same thing? Because that is exactly what he did or blaming Bush for 8 years... Trump is just over 1 month into this, so let's see if he will actually fix something or not. If he just blame his predecessor then he will lose my respect just like Obama did. Cardboard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hawks Posted February 28, 2017 Share Posted February 28, 2017 Cardboard If you are saying Trump and Obama are the same type of personality type by blaming others for their problems, how do you explain that Obama commanded a lot of respect around the world, but Trump does not. Trump as a personality always finds scapegoats for his troubles including workers who worked for him who didn't get paid cause "they did shoddy work"! The lawsuits against him for not paying his bills are numerous. Obama worked in the slums of Chicago and had credibilitiy there; Trump lacks credibility with many of his own workers and those he has trampled over. Just ask residents and the govt officials in Scotland. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cardboard Posted February 28, 2017 Share Posted February 28, 2017 A major reason is the very left leaning media that plays constantly negative stories on Trump which you did not see under Obama. Everything, and I mean everything, he does is portrayed as negative. It is just like watching Fox News under Obama and I think it is worst since Fox had some restraint. It was more cynical. Don't get me wrong, Obama came out as Mr. Nice guy, but it helps when you have the media in near full adulation. Exact same thing happening in Canada with Trudeau now while Harper was the devil. It still can't be denied that Obama blamed Bush for almost everything. Cardboard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hawks Posted February 28, 2017 Share Posted February 28, 2017 But it is not so simple as left leaning versus right leaning media. I'm talking personalities and value systems. For the most part, Obama was respected as a person around the globe, Trump is not. Scapegoats are everywhere for him - Muslims, CNN, NY Times, France, Merkel. For the thousands of Americans murdered every year in the U.S., Obama correctly saw it was too loose gun regulations; Trump thinks it's Muslim terrorists and Mexican rapists and hoodlums. It's American citizens who are doing most of the killings; this is not "fake news" Grant your point re blaming Bush; more accurately it was Bush and Clinton who weakened the financial regulations then all hell broke loose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cardboard Posted February 28, 2017 Share Posted February 28, 2017 "For the thousands of Americans murdered every year in the U.S., Obama correctly saw it was too loose gun regulations; Trump thinks it's Muslim terrorists and Mexican rapists and hoodlums. It's American citizens who are doing most of the killings; this is not "fake news"" You are mixing things up. Obama wants gun control like the left. Trump doesn't want it like Republicans and most Libertarians. You have to respect Americans for their own desire. If they want guns and to protect themselves that is their choice. If they want to get rid of it, they would need some kind of referendum. This mentality is not popular in Europe but, it was also the birth place of the worst dictator of all times and so many tyrants throughout history because they had full control. Terrorism, national security and immigration are whole different topics. Maybe that Obama was respected in your part of the world but, he certainly wasn't by Iran, Syria, Russia, North Korea and others. They saw him as weak and tried to abuse him at every possible instance. Cardboard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peregrine Posted February 28, 2017 Share Posted February 28, 2017 INB4 Cardboard....oh wait. Not at all surprising that the Trump administration has been silent on this: http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/politics/2017/02/trump_s_silence_about_two_indians_shot_in_kansas_speaks_volumes.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cardboard Posted February 28, 2017 Share Posted February 28, 2017 Just like Obama was silent on innocent cops being shot in the streets or thousands shots each year in his own city of Chicago. What is surprising is that the Nobel Peace prize winner was silent on that... Cardboard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peregrine Posted February 28, 2017 Share Posted February 28, 2017 I kind of knew that the "but xyz is worse!" response was soon to follow. Let's not let facts get in the way of arguments, though: http://www.politico.com/story/2016/07/obama-police-baton-rouge-225679 And hey, it looks like he can criticize the much derided BLM movement as well: http://www.nbcnews.com/news/nbcblk/president-obama-calls-out-black-lives-matter-activists-yelling-n561046 Anyway, this thread is showing harbingers of past political threads so I'll refrain from going further.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mephistopheles Posted March 1, 2017 Share Posted March 1, 2017 "Obama did it too" doesn't make what Trump did right or wrong. We should judge every action on its merits. If we want to use that logic than I should point out that Washington and Jefferson owned slaves. Anything Trump does hasn't even come close. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gregmal Posted March 1, 2017 Share Posted March 1, 2017 "Obama did it too" doesn't make what Trump did right or wrong. We should judge every action on its merits. If we want to use that logic than I should point out that Washington and Jefferson owned slaves. Anything Trump does hasn't even come close. Thats true, and quite fine. What is trite is that there is a huge double standard with the media, and with a lot of folks out there. A lot of people didn't vote for Obama yet you didn't see riots and widescale protests either time he was elected. Now the shoe is on the other foot and there is no shortage and people whining and crying about the injustices of "they didn't get their way". Trump comes in and you already have people licking their chops to call him a phony and a fraud for not doing what he said he was going to do. Then, unlike the modern day politician, he starts doing, exactly what he said he was going to do, and people are flabbergasted at the audacity of what he's doing. And no, I'm not even talking about the moronic, non educated silver spoon Hollywood types like Katy Perry, Scarlet Johanssen and Madonna. You can see examples of this here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mephistopheles Posted March 1, 2017 Share Posted March 1, 2017 "Obama did it too" doesn't make what Trump did right or wrong. We should judge every action on its merits. If we want to use that logic than I should point out that Washington and Jefferson owned slaves. Anything Trump does hasn't even come close. Thats true, and quite fine. What is trite is that there is a huge double standard with the media, and with a lot of folks out there. A lot of people didn't vote for Obama yet you didn't see riots and widescale protests either time he was elected. Now the shoe is on the other foot and there is no shortage and people whining and crying about the injustices of "they didn't get their way". Trump comes in and you already have people licking their chops to call him a phony and a fraud for not doing what he said he was going to do. Then, unlike the modern day politician, he starts doing, exactly what he said he was going to do, and people are flabbergasted at the audacity of what he's doing. And no, I'm not even talking about the moronic, non educated silver spoon Hollywood types like Katy Perry, Scarlet Johanssen and Madonna. You can see examples of this here. Double standards exist everywhere - in the media and with the people, nothing we can do about it, hence stick with the merits. You can say people didn't riot against Obama, and I can say Obama didn't take on a campaign to question the legitimacy and legality of his predecessor, and it goes on and on. And again if people say Trump's a phony, well if they have a constructive reason, I'm all for that discussion. If it's just bullshit, well I'm all against it. Here I'll give you one just from today - the PC outrage that Kellyanne Conway was sitting on her knees in the oval office. Btw I'm no Obama fanboy and I think it was criminal how he treated private shareholders FNMA/FMCC. Just saying it to point out I'm capable of being unbiased. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cardboard Posted March 1, 2017 Share Posted March 1, 2017 Hey Frank87, he did address the Kansas shooting tonight early in his speech in front of Congress and the Nation. Will you retract your words? Cardboard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peregrine Posted March 1, 2017 Share Posted March 1, 2017 I do and I am glad that he did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gregmal Posted March 1, 2017 Share Posted March 1, 2017 We want to talk about fake news/media bias? http://www.cnbc.com/2017/02/28/president-donald-trump-practice-congress-speech-in-back-of-car.html How exactly is this newsworthy, or necessarily something to present as "weird". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mephistopheles Posted March 1, 2017 Share Posted March 1, 2017 We want to talk about fake news/media bias? http://www.cnbc.com/2017/02/28/president-donald-trump-practice-congress-speech-in-back-of-car.html How exactly is this newsworthy, or necessarily something to present as "weird". So what's the bias or fake news here? The article points out the fact that he was practicing in back of the car. I'd relate to your sentiment if they knocked him for it, but they didn't. Newsworthy? no. Fake? no. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gregmal Posted March 1, 2017 Share Posted March 1, 2017 We want to talk about fake news/media bias? http://www.cnbc.com/2017/02/28/president-donald-trump-practice-congress-speech-in-back-of-car.html How exactly is this newsworthy, or necessarily something to present as "weird". So what's the bias or fake news here? The article points out the fact that he was practicing in back of the car. I'd relate to your sentiment if they knocked him for it, but they didn't. Newsworthy? no. Fake? no. You read this, or any of the other pieces on the same thing and don't see it as rife with negative connotation? The random Twitter quotes? Presenting him as "weird" or some sort of buffoon for practicing a speech? Why is this is even a headline. Surprisingly, I have noticed a different tone in a lot of the stuff put out today after last nights speech. That doesn't negate the fact that for the past year the media has gone so far out of their way to undermine and make him look bad. The Nazi Germany comparisons? Seriously? In fact this, more than anything else in my opinion is what put Trump over the top with the election. There were many people who were just so sick and tired of the media doing everything it could to will Clinton into office. The same media the had Kyrie Irving's "the world is flat" quote as front page news recently. These guys are a bunch of clowns and its amusing that they continue to be perplexed as to why they are hated and no longer allowed to do big boy jobs; like access the president. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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