Myth465

You guys are quite lucky to have a winner right about now. Im looking for things to sell, to raise capital. It seems I am always caught on the backend on these sorts of things ;D. Josh I need to pay more attention to your ideas lol.

Well said

LOL

Thanks for the post bargain.

LOL I really agree. I am young, but I am guessing this aint his first rodeo. He always has a reason for not investing. The goal should be increasing intrinsic value not control. Buying any number of securities from 2008 till now would have done just that......

Parsad I find your optimism refreshing and its nice that you arent simple a bet on America perma optimist like Buffett. Same outcome, but I prefer your rationale.

sswan11 thanks that says what I think so much better then I ever could. Its like people cant walk and chew gum.. We are headed to where the UK is at right now.

I think its a cop out. Its been that way for 3-4 years. How you get through the financial crisis having seen no opportunities..... I mean what exactly are you looking for - LUK, BRK, and countless others found stuff to buy. Oil hit $35, nat gas at $5 and still nothing.................. I cant give them credit for doing nothing during the biggest downturn in the last 20 - 30 years. Thanks for the transcript you can read them so much faster then listen. I do like the buybacks, they are getting a great discount to IV. I would prefer a few key minority positions though.

Watching loews is like watching paint dry. They should be able to deploy cash now....

This is something I forget from time to time. Bill Maher will usually remind me every few months or so though.

All I am saying is find another place to vent ;D. We have had terrible Government for 10 years (inmo), maybe 18 depending on your political leanings, and maybe since the founding of the Republic if you are simply a Libertarian anarchist. Also I have seen the medicare thing in a few other places, around the same time. That inmo makes it a talking point. When you ask people to defend things they dont care about it appears straw mannish. I dont agree with your politics (you seem a bit angry), but have issues with your style. Many people here think its the fact that you are right of center, but it has more to do with your tactics / style for me. Finally its trollish to come to a board about sports, investing, basket weaving, or fantasy football - and exclusive post about politics but claim you are lurking regarding the major board topic...... Enough food for today I guess.

I dont like when people simply try to put me on the other side of whatever issue they want to talk about and thats what you do. Its the same 5 talking points over and over. We could be having a conversation about something completely unrelated to Medicare and Medicaid and you will come in with your little spill about how its 50 times more then its initial projection then ask if that makes sense or for someone to defend the program. If you want to have a conversation start a thread, if you want to join the conversation join it. But I wont engage with someone who is a one trick straw man pony. You seem to exclusive want to engage in political conversations where you simple bitch about the Government. All I am saying is there are plenty of better places then that.

Lee Kuan Yew inmo is a first rate politician. When did he say this, interesting comment.

Or just leave. It appears that you have nothing to say on investing, and there are hundreds of better places to do what you are doing........

Very interesting move. I have been watching tankers for a year. If I had billions this is how I would invest. The company can now go out and buy tankers at a deep discount. The lower costs should allow them to operate them at a profit while others have losses.

I think Krugman has it right. I dont think spending is the key but its been shown that cuts simple slow the economy and reduce GDP. 2012 will be interesting... http://feedproxy.google.com/~r/EconomistsView/~3/EqOuY9y4_SU/paul-krugman-the-president-surrenders.html

I think the demand is people seeking education. These people really shouldnt be and should be funneled into trades or low level jobs where they can still earn a living (like in Europe education is free, but you most qualify). Due to this countries idiotic focus on education (most presidents seem to think everyone in the country needs a college degree), universities have expanded to develop programs for these students who probably arent served well by college. The issue though is finding a job without a college degree, even a crappy one, is tougher and tougher so the kids and parents in some ways are acting rationally. Yes I believe the lobbyists and special interests are getting the profits of the market model with the subsidies of the European model. Its an unholy alliance to bankrupt the country. Either model works well, but mixing of both is disastrous. Its why I think compromise is overrated. In reality the voters need to choose one option, and pay for it or receive the low taxes as a result of their choice. My issue with most Republicans is they ignore the public's choice and simple opt for low taxes to force the issue. Its undemocratic, and inmo unpatriotic. People like something for nothing which is what modern right leaning politicians promise. Lets have a real debate, High taxes and high quality services (properly run), or low taxes and reduced services. I dont really care and will do well with either option. I personally think society is better served by the Northern European model (perhaps I am jaded though having seen the worst of our model and best of theirs, the US model worked surprisingly well in the 60s when one could work a summer to pay for a school year and graduated with little debt). Education like Housing has a powerful unnatural grip on people.

Either way we hit the fan. We are doing exactly what Japan did and what Koo thinks we shouldnt do. Cutting spending will slow growth, its just Econ 101. Perhaps it needs to be done, but it doesnt help unemployment or GDP growth. Why arent simply ending both wars completely on the table. At the end of the day Jimmy Rogers was right....

Packer as with most things in life there are 2 options. Government can take over healthcare or education and drive the price down (Denmark, Sweden, Norway). Or Government can pull back, offer a small subsidy, and let the market and supply and demand take care of the rest. What happens in the US is some sort of crappy compromise which features the worst features of both options.... We have grade inflation in education and everyone believes sending a child to college (regardless of major, intelligence, or ability) is a ticket to the middle class. Now we have too much demand on education and not enough supply....

Took you a while Myth :) A couple of months ago I did not think moderator tools were needed. Now I think the time has come. All these politics threads started by just a handful new members is well beyond the mission of B&F Corner. Im a little slow but I come around lol. You have my vote, and regardless I will avoid feeding.....

Southern I now believe you are simply a troll... A good one none the less. Congrats well played.... http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.somethingimpressive.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/04/successful-troll-is-successful.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.airliners.net/aviation-forums/non_aviation/read.main/2346009/1/&h=441&w=300&sz=39&tbnid=_KIYR6gnlAfZxM:&tbnh=97&tbnw=66&prev=/search%3Fq%3Dsuccessful%2Btroll%26tbm%3Disch%26tbo%3Du&zoom=1&q=successful+troll&docid=EpyJ1DkfAs2hmM&sa=X&ei=l0UzTpzfNIHhsQLKnrj9Cg&ved=0CCoQ9QEwAg&dur=780

I think you have made my point better then I could. Back to the world of investing..... Politicians posture? No surprise. Making a speech and a protest vote that everyone knows wont matter is a bit different then whats going on today isnt it? Where you sit depends on where you stand especially when you only look for things that confirm your thoughts. Good old Harry and Barry would have caved by now dont you think?

I edited my prior post, before you posted. Also I dont think so. I have done this for years. You seem like a convinced Libertarian / Anti Government Republican. I dont have time or energy to debate Free to Choose, Ayn Rand, or other philosophical, intellectual, or hypothetical situations. People tend to lean left, or right and I believe its largely based on upbringing and orientation. Both sides have good ideas, but have basically for the last 30 years conspired to bankrupt the country. You want to blame one side and cheer-lead for your side. That's fine, but its a distraction. One side spends, one side cuts taxes. Well both sides spend - one on wars and tax cuts, the other on programs for the people. I wont pretend though that both parties are just as bad as each other or that this manufactured crisis isnt being perpetuated by one party against the country for political reasons. We all Suffer from Commentator’s Disease, I am aware of it and prefer not to do the dance - Commentator’s Disease. - http://www.fredoneverything.net/Commentators.shtml I often see victims of Commentator’s Disease arguing against the minimum wage on abstract grounds of economic theory. It is what commentators do—bandy abstractions, railing for or against Keynes, assaulting their ideological opponents with pointed phrases. They have never had to do the arithmetic of forty times the minimum wage minus taxes minus bus fare minus rent and gotta pay the cable because it is the only thing they have after work. They have never had to choose between the electric bill and a new coat as winter comes on. The commentators don’t realize that not everybody is like them. Those with IQs of 140 and up (130 gets you into Mensa, I think) unconsciously believe that anything is possible. Denizens of this class know that if they decided to learn, say, classical Greek, they could. You get the book and go at it. It would take work, yes, and time, but the outcome would be certain. They don’t understand that the waitress has an IQ of 85 and can’t learn much of anything. Conservatives think in terms of merciless abstractions and liberals insist that everyone is equal. Not even close. Further, people with barely a high-school education and low-voltage minds regard any intellectual task with utter discouragement. Some commentators urge letting people invest their Social Security taxes in the stock market. To them it is a question of abstract freedom and probably the Federalist papers. The commentators are smart enough to invest money. I’ll guess that at least half the population isn’t. Go into the tit bar (does it still exist) in Waldorf, Maryland, and ask the dump-truck drivers and nail-pounders what NASDAQ is.Liberal commentators want everyone to go to college, when about a fifth of people have the brains. Conservatives think that people can rise by hard work and sacrifice as certainly many people have. Thing is, most people can’t. Commentators only see those who made it. The tendency of the Beltway 99th to live in an imaginary world, of conservatives to think that everybody can be a Horatio Alger, of liberals to believe that inequality arises from discrimination, guarantees wretched policy. Those who can do almost anything need to recognize the existence of those who can do almost nothing. Few of the latter are parasites. The waitress has worked all her life, as has the truck driver. They ended up with nothing. Which is easy to do. A girl marries her high-school sweetheart in Busted Hump, Tennessee and he goes to work for the local pickle-bottling plant, which switches to hiring people as independent contractors to avoid paying benefits. Neither of the pair is real bright, just ordinary Americans trying to make a living. They live paycheck to paycheck because they don’t know how not to. Neither is lazy. They just don’t know how to start the next Microsoft. He dies of a heart attack at 45, she can’t make the mortgage, and…she is well and truly screwed. At the Zoo Bar, they have great wings and some really good walk-in blues bands, and what you have to understand about Keynes is…. --------------- If you really want to learn here is a good site with pretty good counter arguments to many Right / Libertarian philosophies - http://www.huppi.com/kangaroo/LiberalFAQ.htm -------------------------------- I do however like discussions of macro but would prefer them to be econ based and not just right vs. left. I find that Jim Rogers has been the most right about this whole situation. We are in for slow growth and out of bullets no matter how you slice it. I also think our engine (middle class consumption) is broken and will be in the shop for another 5 years. Not sure who will pick up the slack once the backup car (Government spending) is also put in the shop. ---- Southern you post facts. But they are straw men. You are trying to bait me into defending social security and medicare. The reality is these programs are here, and liked by and large by most of the citizens. If your argument is to cut them, then your team should run on that. I predict losses. Given that situation we should just make the people pay for the programs. You have grand ideas on how things should be run and what the government should do. I dont care, I just ask that when people get something its paid for in full. You preach freedom, but all I really see from Libertarians / Hardcore Republicans is control. They want the rest of the country to agree with them through hell or high water. Polls show people like these programs.... I dont plan on using any of them, but if they are going to exist they should be paid for in full using open and honest accounting.

Ya this is quickly devolving. I think everyone has their mind made up. Southern is fairly convinced of the answers to all the questions. We should keep these conversations on other boards, myself included... The real question is how do you separate politics from Macro? Given whats going. I bore of right and left debates because as someone else said no one is really open. Southern now wants me to mount a defense of Medicare, Medicaid, and Government all together. Something I find annoying and boring. Fact is the programs are around and must be paid for..... I think both parties have lots of issues, but also pride myself on calling a spade a spade. In this case, one party is really the cause of this manufactured crisis. Macro is key inmo and worth discussing. The new normal inmo is real, and ubuy2wron inmo is headed towards the right direction. 70% of the economy is consumption, and the consumers are tapped out and paying off debt. Not sure how you solve that problem. I would prefer to discuss this and aspects around it vs argue the merits of Individualism, New Deal Policies, and the Evils of Big Government. Those are all abstract and wont change. My primary goal is to further my understanding of politics / economics - not to defend the left and attack the right. jjsto - Nice way to bring facts into the discussion. I agree, but was too lazy to bring up the data because I know it will be ignored. Ideology trumps facts in these types of discussions.

My networth feels like there is a panic lol. Death by a thousand paper cuts due to Euroland and Debt ceiling, earnings should have created a great rally inmo. I am down across the board over the last 5 weeks, but its been chipped at each day little by little.....