Pizza is a vegetable!!!

[bargainman]

For all those food fans, an interesting look at the power of the food lobby:

 

http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/04/27/us-usa-foodlobby-idUSBRE83Q0ED20120427

 

 

[rkbabang]

Categorizing pizza as a vegetable is pretty funny, and pretty typical, but I don't agree with the tone of the article at all.  I certainly don't want any "restrictions" passed into law or new taxes.  I'd be happy if the USDA simply stopped recommending a diet rich in whole grains and the federal government stopped its corn and other grain subsidies, and simply let the science speak for itself.

 

And, whatever else they do at any level of government, they should not threaten nutritional bloggers with 120 days in jail for blogging about nutrition, when they point out the government lies.

 

Blogging About the Paleo Diet Can Get You Shut Down in North Carolina

 

 

Maybe it is the libertarian in me but with this issue, like every other issue, I just want to government to back off and stop every single thing that it is doing.  I certainly don't advocate it "do more". Heaven help us, the government has done enough already.

 

[Guest Hester]

Categorizing pizza as a vegetable is pretty funny, and pretty typical, but I don't agree with the tone of the article at all.  I certainly don't want any "restrictions" passed into law or new taxes.  I'd be happy if the USDA simply stopped recommending a diet rich in whole grains and the federal government stopped its corn and other grain subsidies, and simply let the science speak for itself.

 

And, whatever else they do at any level of government, they should not threaten nutritional bloggers with 120 days in jail for blogging about nutrition, when they point out the government lies.

 

Blogging About the Paleo Diet Can Get You Shut Down in North Carolina

 

 

Maybe it is the libertarian in me but with this issue, like every other issue, I just want to government to back off and stop every single thing that it is doing.  I certainly don't advocate it "do more". Heaven help us, the government has done enough already.

 

I agree with everything you said, but how do you let the science speak for itself, when so few people are going to study nutritional science even once during their life. Nutrition science is complex as you know, and the public needs experts on the matter to guide them on what to eat.

 

We both agree that the government is dead wrong and has failed on telling people what is a healthy diet, but I still think Americans need somebody to tell them what to eat. The question is, what's the best way to communicate the science to the masses? I personally don't know.

[rkbabang]

 

I agree with everything you said, but how do you let the science speak for itself, when so few people are going to study nutritional science even once during their life. Nutrition science is complex as you know, and the public needs experts on the matter to guide them on what to eat.

 

We both agree that the government is dead wrong and has failed on telling people what is a healthy diet, but I still think Americans need somebody to tell them what to eat. The question is, what's the best way to communicate the science to the masses? I personally don't know.

 

Right now, rightly or wrongly (I'd say wrongly) people trust the USDA.  They are doing what the USDA tells them to.  Look at how much saturated fat consumption has dropped and polyunsaturated fat consumption has increased since the food pyramid first came out.  The problem isn't that Americans aren't doing what they are told, the problem is that they ARE doing what they have been told.

 

When I say people trust the federal government I mean doctors as well.  Talk to any doctor about his training in nutrition and you will find that he took one or two courses in medical school on nutrition which pretty much taught him the USDA recommendations.  In the absence of the government telling us (and our doctors) what to think, any doctor that wanted to keep current on Nutrition would actually have to keep current on topics such as nutrition.  There is a flood of new research in the last 5 - 10 years that no doctor I've talked to knows anything about.  Why should they?  The government updated the food pyramid with the "my pyramid" and just updated that with the "my plate".  They think they know all there is to know.  If there was something new, surely the USDA would send them a pamphlet.  Have a detailed talk with your doctor about what he knows in this area and how he knows it. Then tell me where I'm wrong.

 

You may find a rare doctor that is interested in nutrition and does keep up to date (If you do you are lucky), but that isn't the norm.

 

There is also liability to worry about.  What if a doctor tells his patients to do exactly the opposite of the USDA recommendations and the results are not good.  Would you take that chance if your livelihood depended on it?  It is much easier and infinitely safer to just parrot the current government recommendations for nutrition and focus on treating illnesses when they appear.  That is how they view their job.  No one ever got sued for telling their patents to eat what the USDA says we should eat. 

 

That is how it works today.  How would it work if there was a separation of nutrition and state.  There would be no overriding authority on how to eat funded by big agra-buisness and given legitimacy by government.  Therefor the current state of the science would be the only place to look.  Some doctors would not keep up, some medical schools would not be current, but the situation would be a hell of a lot better than it is now.  It isn't just nutrition or biochemistry, it is the same in any science, nothing should ever be considered "settled".  People should know that science is an on-going process and that we don't know more than we know. They should not be given a false sense of security that the government has determined what's healthy and what isn't.  People, like doctors, don't take the time to think about this simply because they don't think they have to.  People really believe that the question about what to eat is all a settled matter.  They believe this, because they have been told this.

 

I have no doubt that if the government starts taxing sugar, that corn-syrup will have some immunity from the tax.  Maybe they will call it a vegetable since its made out of corn.  After all, how much sense does it make to subsidize the production then turn around and tax the consumption?  Then again, nothing the government does has to make sense. Maybe they will increase the subsidies to reimburse the corporations for the sales lost due to the tax, screwing the tax-payers in both directions. What they will then focus on is saturated fat and cholesterol.  Which means my grass-fed butter, coconut-oil, grass-fed meats, and eggs will be more expensive then they already are, and the hydrogenated vegetable oil McDonalds uses to cook its french fries will not be taxed at all.  This will not solve any problems and will make things a whole hell of a lot worse.  It will cost me more, but I will still be able to eat a healthy diet, like everything the government does in all areas of our economy, its effects on the poor will be devastating.

 

[keerthiprasad]

I recently graduated from medical school (in the last 2yrs) and I agree with you that medical education is limited in nutrition.  I think a physician has a huge knowledge base that helps understand nutrition, but few do for a variety of reasons.  The general knowledge base out there is very minimal. 

 

My impression is that much of this stems from a lack of understanding of the science and its limitations.  There is a ton of poor research being conducted all the time.  I think it is a true limitation of the science and its ability to be studied.  It is just too complex of a process with many variables and a long time course to event.However, we do have some very good exercise/diet recommendations that I think really improve the populations health (especially related to hypercholesterolemia, diabetes and hypertension).

 

I definitely agree that the government's recs are not in the general public's interest.