Osama Bin Laden: 1957 - 2011

[Parsad]

Needless to say, Sanjeev, today is a GREAT DAY to be an American!  Great Day!!! 

 

Yes, I agree!  But isn't it always a great day to be an American?

 

So, we will clean up our GDP mess, our deficit and our health care problem.  Just give us time.

 

Yes, you will.  One way or another, you will!  That's the thing about the American two-party system...it works, and it will continue to work, regardless of idiots like Donald Trump and Whoopi Goldberg. 

 

By the way, just so you right-wingers don't think I'm completely a leftie, I'm voting for Harper...again!  You're President isn't quite the leftie you all thought he was.  Yes, he believes that things need to be more equitable in the U.S., and I happen to agree, but he runs up the middle for the most part, and has a bit of a right-wing streak when it comes to foreign policy and economics...contrary to public opinion.  Cheers!

 

[Alekbaylee]

But at least we are making attempts at treaties and creating an environment that will perhaps help foster a more equitable life for Canada's aboriginals.  Aboriginal's are also a sixth of the size of Canada's population relative to the black population in the U.S.

 

Agree. Was refering specifically to the % of aboriginal in correctional facilities : 18,5 % inmates serving a federal sentence are aboriginal. It's a lot and points to a systemic problem.

[Myth465]

Well said, Sanjeev, except that we do treat our Aboriginal people as bad as the US treats its black population. IMHO. And of course, it's very sad in both case.

 

I would say blacks are doing ok down here. I mean there is no Aboriginal President anywhere around the corner. As a black guy, I think the Native Americans are a much cleaner comparison. Though all parties involved got screwed over in History. Having been to Oz, I will say I think the Aboriginals have it way worse. The things an Australian can say about an Aboriginals in a crowded room made me blush, and its hard for a black guy to blush. Again very similar to Native Americans, these things usually arent said about blacks due to fear and PCness.

 

---

 

Damn Parsad, way to make a proud (but disgruntled) American blush. I like to refer to Canada as the 51st state. That reference feels a bit dated, perhaps we should follow you guys. And you are correct its always a great day to be an American, Not too many other places I would rather be from. I dont think anyone here (especially on this forum) would reshuffle the deck and choose another of the 6 - 7 billion cards.

[tyska]

I feel like Personal freedoms, or belief in government over the individual is nonsense code speak. Im not saying its code speak for racism. I am just saying its what you say when a Democrat is in the White House, when you need a reason to make your dislike sound legit / intellectual.

 

Civil liberties have been under attack for decades, and really went down hill after 9/11. I dont see many differences in terms of personal freedoms under either administration or party. They seem to get chipped at with each passing crisis, and never get fully restored. I also think Americans and perhaps Canadians have no idea what its like to be have your real and true freedoms under attack, to have your wealth redistributed, or to have your land appropriated. Some of the stuff I read about in the third world is truly scary (Check out the Obit in the economist the week before last about a white farmer from South Africa), and makes the Obama assault on our personal freedoms seem quite comical.

 

Also where is this smaller government everyone speaks of. It seems to grow regardless of who is in power. Some people want to give money to colleges and poor people, some want to buy military kit and maintain bases all over the world. Some want to pay for things today via tax hikes, some want to put it on the credit card and let the magic of the market work its magic. Either way year after year, the Government grows. Yet we have a party of smaller government (that seems to expand the government more then the other party), and one of big government.

 

Its all quite amusing. Just my thoughts.

Myth

If I could rec you, I would for that post. Not knowing as much about you as say Bronco does, I'll assume you are an American. It seems when it comes to politics most don't want to look objectively at what each party actually does. Or look at how much people who say they are on the right demand from the government. A simple one is Ag policy in the States. Most of the people in rural Ag states would be all over the statement "less Govt", but touch the floor price for grains, buying dairy for school lunches, or horrors Ethanol subsidies and well you know what will happen. Same for Ag subsidies here in Canada. As a farmer, I would be stupid to not take advantage of them. But they don't do what they are portrayed to do and their would still be Agriculture going on without them. Just like there would still be cars to drive if they stopped bailing out auto makers.

 But then, thinking like Bronco and living in Canada, were does one align themselves. With a party that says it believes in smaller Govt, yet expands it through a plethora of programs. Or the parties that don't even hide that they want to expand govt to intrude on personnel freedom. Conundrum indeed.

[Alekbaylee]

I mean there is no Aboriginal President anywhere around the corner

 

There's Evo Morales in Bolivia...

 

By the way, just so you right-wingers don't think I'm completely a leftie, I'm voting for Harper...again!

Really? You must be the only one in Vancouver!  ;D

[S2S]

To be fair to the Fox Newsers on this board, Rush Limbaugh and Glenn Beck have both jumped in on the lovefest

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/2011/05/02/2011-05-02_rush_limbaugh_glenn_beck_shower_praise_on_president_thank_god_for_president_obam.html

[onyx1]

 

Sorry to change the subject, sightly.

 

But the often-criticized CIA interrogators derserve some credit here !! (though I dont think they will get it)

 

From the Associated Press:

 

"Officials say CIA interrogators in secret overseas prisons developed the first strands of information that ultimately led to the killing of Osama bin Laden.

 

Current and former U.S. officials say that Khalid Sheikh Mohammed, the mastermind of the Sept. 11, 2001 terrorist attacks, provided the nom de guerre of one of bin Laden's most trusted aides. The CIA got similar information from Mohammed's successor, Abu Faraj al-Libi. Both were subjected to harsh interrogation tactics inside CIA prisons in Poland and Romania. "

 

[Guest ValueCarl]

I am not disagreeing that this is a multi-decade problem derived from the incumbent two party system performing poorly on the behalf of the best interest of their people. Nor, am I denying the degree of difficulty for turning it around or whether the US is better or worse than Canada, for that matter. I think the globe's problems stem from a diabolic force much higher in the pyramid who is directly responsible for this earth's woes and won't stop until it owns it all by its power, influence and control. Not until that force is dealt with head on, will global citizens find true peace. Not even sure that it's possible, but that's why I referenced Ron Paul's movement recently in addition to the DOD document tied to the David Sokol punt I kicked the other night.

 

Messrs Buffett and Munger proved my point this weekend too, when thinking about their cavalier attitudes towards just printing us deeper in the abyss. Their self-interest is far greater than their countrymen. It is this principle that went UNCHECKED for so long, which has gotten Americans in their mess. Our intermediary, this beast called the Federal Reserve, is at the core of the US' problem.     

 

I have been enjoying Alice Schroeder's blog for what seems to be deeply thought out Berkshire questions that sometimes includes perplexing world questions when dealing with the pertinent question of management vs. labor disputes, and the constant battle between both historically. A good question to have been proposed to The Oracle, might have been contained in an "Outsourcing America" post there, in order for him to explain to his American counterparts, how they're going compete mathematically forging ahead, rather than laughing about their politicians needing to scramble to the FRAUDSTERS' NO RISK @ INTEREST money troughs-RAISE the DEBT CEILING-like the little debt piggies that they are.

 

If I am correct as I believe I am in this diabolic pyramid I choose to reference-inner eye-ruling the earth's resources, most importantly, its PEOPLE, then all countryman, Canadian or otherwise, will never REST EASY nor FREELY!  :(                 

[turar]

I'm still confused why he was buried so quickly, and at sea for that matter. The official explanations given do not sound very persuasive.

[Mikenhe]

I'm still confused why he was buried so quickly, and at sea for that matter. The official explanations given do not sound very persuasive.

 

The speed is due to Muslim beliefs. Burial at sea is acceptable as I'm sure that theres no Government that would have wanted him buried on their lands. I hope they gave him the proper send off according to Muslim beliefs.

 

 

 

As someone above mentioned congrats to the CIA for their part in tracking him down. And very well done for training him so well that he could be on the run for a decade without being caught ;)

[Guest ValueCarl]

Do you understand the severity of what I write here and how it turns to tyranny over time? It is perfectly natural and right for Messrs Buffett and Munger to feel this way, as it is for David Sokol to want to branch out on his own in building his own Family Dynasty.

 

It is at the CORE of Adam Smith's Invisible Hand, and breeds great success if the individual capitalists striving for their goals to be attained, are constantly innovating and creating better solutions for their end users who will ultimately benefit-quality of lives-in the long term from their work.

 

However, as soon as the self-interest of any individual or group, capitalists, politicians or otherwise, crosses lines that act against the best interests of the whole, especially in the case of a society at large; they should fail or be KILLED for violating their duties while being disloyal to the principles of honor and integrity which forces one to ask, would I like that to happen to me, my wife, or my family, if it were to occur?              

 

<Messrs Buffett and Munger proved my point this weekend too, when thinking about their cavalier attitudes towards just printing us deeper in the abyss. Their self-interest is far greater than their countrymen. It is this principle that went UNCHECKED for so long, which has gotten Americans in their mess. Our intermediary, this beast called the Federal Reserve, is at the core of the US' problem.>      

[Guest ValueCarl]

One last thing, my board brothers, and any smart sisters hanging around.  

 

If the inner eye or SYSTEM weakens you enough by reducing your self-worth, you will begin to TOLERATE even ACCEPT the greatest atrocities the world is still waiting to be delivered!  

 

Stand up against TYRANTS wherever they dwell, or you will all end up looking in one form or another like OSAMA killed by OBAMA!  >:(

 

 

[turar]

I'm still confused why he was buried so quickly, and at sea for that matter. The official explanations given do not sound very persuasive.

The speed is due to Muslim beliefs. Burial at sea is acceptable as I'm sure that theres no Government that would have wanted him buried on their lands. I hope they gave him the proper send off according to Muslim beliefs.

 

It doesn't make sense to me though. They killed the guy, shot a bullet through his head, which is clearly against Muslim beliefs, and a much greater sin in Islam, and now they're worried about proper burial? And at sea, no less?!? They haven't even asked any government, from the sound of it. Very, very strange.

[Parsad]

If the inner eye or SYSTEM weakens you enough by reducing your self-worth, you will begin to TOLERATE even ACCEPT the greatest atrocities the world is still waiting to be delivered!

 

Carl, if you think that is the case, you should be selling LVLT and buying gold!   ;D

 

Incidentally, here is a short, but terrific article by David Frum, who is a right-winger Canadian and former speech-writer for the Bush Administration.  Cheers!

 

http://www.cnn.com/2011/OPINION/05/02/frum.binladen.obama/index.html?hpt=T2

[Parsad]

It doesn't make sense to me though. They killed the guy, shot a bullet through his head, which is clearly against Muslim beliefs, and a much greater sin in Islam, and now they're worried about proper burial? And at sea, no less?!? They haven't even asked any government, from the sound of it. Very, very strange.

 

They used facial recognition software on site after the operation.  They removed the body, as well as a ton of information that was present.  They had one of his wives view the body and confirm it was him.  They then ran DNA tests using Bin Laden family DNA for confirmation. 

 

The burial at sea was so that there was no way for his comrades to gather around and celebrate his burial...thus the U.S. government did not ask to bury the body on soil in any nation that may have wanted him.  At the same time, I'm assuming the U.S. government didn't want to offend the Muslim faith, and gave him a proper burial according to Muslim customs.  Cheers! 

[Parsad]

Another related and funny story!  I'm sure Trump was pissed.  Cheers!

 

http://marquee.blogs.cnn.com/2011/05/02/president-obama-interrupts-trumps-show/?hpt=Sbin

[Alekbaylee]

And for more details, please refer (or wait for) to next year's Hollywood block buster : How Seal Team Six captured Bin Ladin or the True story of Bin Ladin's capture, etc. ;D

[Smazz]

 

The burial at sea was so that there was no way for his comrades to gather around and celebrate his burial...thus the U.S. government did not ask to bury the body on soil in any nation that may have wanted him.  At the same time, I'm assuming the U.S. government didn't want to offend the Muslim faith, and gave him a proper burial according to Muslim customs.  Cheers! 

As per Muslim law he had to be buried in 24 hrs and it has been stated no available countrys (or acceptable) were prepared to accept his body.

 

The killing was warranted as a previous killer of many innocent - the insult of burial as per muslim beliefs would not have been thats why they stayed the course on that.

[Guest ValueCarl]

Sanjeev, I hope you're not providing me with another bad omen for what lies in store for (3) owners tomorrow, although they have experienced enough atrocities over the decade to weather nearly any storm left that is thrown at them! As for gold, I was a silver bug to FIFTY PER OZ.(the better bang for APPRECIATION), remember!  ;D

 

With the exception of the valueless one dollar bill WEB pulled from his pocket this weekend, a dollar that could hardly purchase one piece of a SEES CANDY, I agree wholeheartedly with their viewpoints on "precious metals" inclusive of gold. However, the exploration of a new currency model and the elimination of the FRAUDSTERS remains crucial in my mind. 

 

Now, I know I may be hated for saying this, and that's o.k. because that's what makes for more honest debates, so if they're going to get the hard currency pressure off of their backs, the way this news is appearing inclusive of helping Trump increase his t.v. show popularity-he's a STOOGE from the start!-even while appearing as a fool, I will not stop believing today's news as, Heil Obama.  >:(   

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_Lie

[turar]

They used facial recognition software on site after the operation.  They removed the body, as well as a ton of information that was present.  They had one of his wives view the body and confirm it was him.  They then ran DNA tests using Bin Laden family DNA for confirmation. 

 

The burial at sea was so that there was no way for his comrades to gather around and celebrate his burial...thus the U.S. government did not ask to bury the body on soil in any nation that may have wanted him.  At the same time, I'm assuming the U.S. government didn't want to offend the Muslim faith, and gave him a proper burial according to Muslim customs.  Cheers! 

 

I suppose. They could have just buried him anywhere in the US, on any military base with restricted access, or something like that. It's not like there's not enough land under US control. Then there's Afghanistan, which is under US control, or at least Kabul and surrounding areas. The sea option is quite unusual in Islam, and doesn't add up well with the explanation for quick burial out of respect for Muslim tradition. I hope there was enough serious evidence gathered and there were credible third-party witnesses besides just a single wife.

 

The optics of quick burial at sea are not great, that's all I'm getting at. They had to realize that.

[turar]

As per Muslim law he had to be buried in 24 hrs and it has been stated no available countrys (or acceptable) were prepared to accept his body.

 

The killing was warranted as a previous killer of many innocent - the insult of burial as per muslim beliefs would not have been thats why they stayed the course on that.

 

From what I've read, it was an assumption on the part of the US government/military. They didn't actually ask any of the governments whether this in fact was the case. And like I said earlier, the US effectively controls the government of Afghanistan, for example, so that explanation is somewhat nonsensical.

[Smazz]

The optics of quick burial at sea are not great, that's all I'm getting at. They had to realize that.

The "quick burial" part was not of the US choosing - that was the Muslim religion. 

To get him back to the US and bury him there, even if they wanted to probably wouldnt have been manageable strictly from a logistics stand point. But really, the US is not going to want to have his body on their soil. That would be a no win situation for anyone.

I think how they handled this was acceptable.

[SouthernYankee]

"Incidentally, here is a short, but terrific article by David Frum, who is a right-winger Canadian and former speech-writer for the Bush Administration."

 

If "right-winger Canadian and former speech-writer for the Bush Administration" is another word for MAJOR LEAGUE PUTZ, then we agree on something.

 

I would vote to raise the debt-ceiling if part of the new debt went to pay Canada to take back Frum.

 

The other money would go to Luongo, to fill in the cracks in his psyche.

 

 

[Parsad]

From what I've read, it was an assumption on the part of the US government/military. They didn't actually ask any of the governments whether this in fact was the case. And like I said earlier, the US effectively controls the government of Afghanistan, for example, so that explanation is somewhat nonsensical.

 

Did you see the celebration in front of the White House or Ground Zero last night?  Americans would go nuts if this monster was buried any place related to the U.S...be it here or in Afghanistan...and rightfully so.  Can you imagine burying Hitler in Israel, Poland, France or England? 

 

The dark depths of the sea are the perfect place for this bastard!  His family and friends will never visit him, and no one can turn his location into a spot for asshole terrorists to gather.  The fish and crabs will eventually devour his rotten corpse and the world will be rid of one more lunatic murderer.  Cheers!   

[txlaw]

The more I read about the details, the more disturbed I get regarding an increased chance of blow up or military action in the region.  

 

See http://www.nytimes.com/2011/05/03/world/asia/03pakistan.html

 

It's remarkable that Bin Laden was located in a secured compound that "sits virtually adjacent to the grounds of a military academy."  The fact that the Times of India talks about the capture blowing Pakistan's cover is predictable.  But the NYT is talking about US officals' distrust of what exactly is going on in the depths of the Pakistani government.  

 

Some serious questions are going to be asked to the Pakistani government now by everyone in the West and by neighbors in the region.  How much in control is the government (versus the military and ISI), really?