Now, thats alignment with shareholders

[Guest valueInv]

Nice:

 

http://www.theverge.com/2013/6/21/4453490/tim-cook-could-lose-half-his-future-stock-compensation-if-apple

[Guest wellmont]

basically if he just performs in line with the average s n p company even at the 34th percentile, he will "only" get around $300m of stock, plus his annual salary and annual cash bonus. :) it looks like Einhorn and others thought his $500m stock award was a bit "excessive". :)

[Guest valueInv]

  On 6/22/2013 at 5:55 PM, wellmont said:

basically if he just performs in line with the average s n p company even at the 34th percentile, he will "only" get around $300m of stock, plus his annual salary and annual cash bonus. :) it looks like Einhorn and others thought his $500m stock award was a bit "excessive". :)

 

And how many dollars in market cap does he have to create over the next 10 years to be in line with the average SNP company and get "only" $300M?

[Guest wellmont]

the fact is just being average will net Mr Cook $300m. not bad work if you can get it.

[Guest valueInv]

  On 6/22/2013 at 8:10 PM, wellmont said:

the fact is just being average will net Mr Cook $300m. not bad work if you can get it.

Being 'average' means he will need to generate half a trillion dollars in market cap.

 

That's easy work if you can get it, right?

 

All in all , he gets paid less than $50m a year to run the most profitable company on the planet.

[Guest valueInv]

  On 6/22/2013 at 8:10 PM, wellmont said:

the fact is just being average will net Mr Cook $300m. not bad work if you can get it.

Actually, the point was alignment not magnitude.

[Guest wellmont]

  On 6/22/2013 at 9:06 PM, valueInv said:

  Quote

the fact is just being average will net Mr Cook $300m. not bad work if you can get it.

Being 'average' means he will need to generate half a trillion dollars in market cap.

 

That's easy work if you can get it, right?

 

All in all , he gets paid less than $50m a year to run the most profitable company on the planet.

 

you forget he started with a half trillion dollar market cap. he started with $100b in the bank. he started as the most profitable company on the planet. plus he started with a fairly low multiple, which was beneficial for him. so all he has to do is maintain status quo and he gets $50m per year.

[Guest valueInv]

  On 6/22/2013 at 9:15 PM, wellmont said:

  Quote

  Quote

the fact is just being average will net Mr Cook $300m. not bad work if you can get it.

Being 'average' means he will need to generate half a trillion dollars in market cap.

 

That's easy work if you can get it, right?

 

All in all , he gets paid less than $50m a year to run the most profitable company on the planet.

 

 

 

you forget he started with a half trillion dollar market cap. he started with $100b in the bank. he started as the most profitable company on the planet. plus he started with a fairly low multiple, which was beneficial for him. so all he has to do is maintain status quo and he gets $50m per year.

 

You forget that to keep up with the SnP, he needs to generate another half a trillion,  not maintain status quo. In another words, Apple will have to be worth almost a Trillion dollars in 2023.

 

I'm sure you think it's a piece of cake ;)

 

And no, apple wasn't worth $500b when he started.

 

[kevin4u2]

Just how much value has he added since becoming CEO? 

[Guest valueInv]

  On 6/22/2013 at 9:58 PM, kevin4u2 said:

Just how much value has he added since becoming CEO?

 

Take a look at their financials

[Guest wellmont]

  On 6/22/2013 at 9:57 PM, valueInv said:

You forget that to keep up with the SnP, he needs to generate another half a trillion,  not maintain status quo. In another words, Apple will have to be worth almost a Trillion dollars in 2023.

 

 

that's only 8.6% cagr of market cap. you think that is some achievement? buffett has done 20% for decades and only makes 100k a year. so if time cook increases stock price by 8.6% a year then he gets $300m. surely you're not in this to make 10% a year are you?

[Guest valueInv]

  On 6/22/2013 at 10:09 PM, wellmont said:

  Quote

You forget that to keep up with the SnP, he needs to generate another half a trillion,  not maintain status quo. In another words, Apple will have to be worth almost a Trillion dollars in 2023.

 

 

that's only 8.6% cagr of market cap. you think that is some achievement? buffett has done 20% per decades and only makes 100k a year.

 

I'm sure Berkshire shareholders will happily pay him twice as much as Cook is he can make Berkshire a trillion dollar company over the next decade.

[Guest valueInv]

  On 6/22/2013 at 10:09 PM, wellmont said:

  Quote

You forget that to keep up with the SnP, he needs to generate another half a trillion,  not maintain status quo. In another words, Apple will have to be worth almost a Trillion dollars in 2023.

 

 

that's only 8.6% cagr of market cap. you think that is some achievement? buffett has done 20% for decades and only makes 100k a year. so if time cook increases stock price by 8.6% a year then he gets $300m. surely you're not in this to make 10% a year are you?

 

The math for me works out a lot better than 10% over the next few years.

[Guest wellmont]

  On 6/22/2013 at 10:15 PM, valueInv said:

  Quote

  Quote

You forget that to keep up with the SnP, he needs to generate another half a trillion,  not maintain status quo. In another words, Apple will have to be worth almost a Trillion dollars in 2023.

 

 

that's only 8.6% cagr of market cap. you think that is some achievement? buffett has done 20% for decades and only makes 100k a year. so if time cook increases stock price by 8.6% a year then he gets $300m. surely you're not in this to make 10% a year are you?

 

The math for me works out a lot better than 10% over the next few years.

 

I don't think so. you said $500b of added market value. that means ending market value is $890b vs today's market value of $390b. ten year time period.

[Guest valueInv]

  On 6/22/2013 at 10:20 PM, wellmont said:

  Quote

  Quote

  Quote

You forget that to keep up with the SnP, he needs to generate another half a trillion,  not maintain status quo. In another words, Apple will have to be worth almost a Trillion dollars in 2023.

 

 

that's only 8.6% cagr of market cap. you think that is some achievement? buffett has done 20% for decades and only makes 100k a year. so if time cook increases stock price by 8.6% a year then he gets $300m. surely you're not in this to make 10% a year are you?

 

The math for me works out a lot better than 10% over the next few years.

 

I don't think so. you said $500b of added market value. that means ending market value is $890b vs today's market value of $390b. ten year time period.

 

I'm throwing out ballpark numbers- I sure you can figure out from the fact they nice round numbers, right?

 

Here's another one -

 

Over the next 10 years, he will have to add almost 3 Berkshires worth of market cap to collect $300M.

 

I'm sure a genius like you will find that easy, but Cook is just your average everyday CeO. ;)

[Guest wellmont]

  On 6/22/2013 at 10:29 PM, valueInv said:

 

I'm throwing out ballpark numbers- I sure you can figure out from the fact they nice round numbers, right?

 

Here's another one -

 

Over the next 10 years, he will have to add almost 3 Berkshires worth of market cap to collect $300M.

 

I'm sure a genius like you will find that easy, but Cook is just your average everyday CeO. ;)

 

Yes it may help to be more precise with your numbers. I think you may be getting hung up with the big numbers. he is starting with $390b. he has $120b of cash in the bank. he has one of the top 3 brands in the world. he has $40b of new capital a year to allocate. he did not produce that $40b. all he has to do is invest it. he has a global distribution system, an r & d pipeline in place, and people to produce and sell new products.

 

the Large numbers sound daunting. but it's the percentages that matter not the absolute numbers. and the fact is he does not have to do heroic things to make extraordinary amounts of money. more power to him. the ceo of apple deserves to make a lot of money.

 

surely you think he can do as well as the average s n p 500 ceo?  you aren't in this to make 10% a year I gather.

[kevin4u2]

  On 6/22/2013 at 10:01 PM, valueInv said:

  Quote

Just how much value has he added since becoming CEO?

 

Take a look at their financials

 

Flat and falling profits. Margins dripping hard in a very competitive industry. Living off the coattails and products of Steve Jobs. Stock has been hammered as a result... 300 million will do.

 

I'll tell you what it would take for me to be interested in Apple. Instead of the usually conference call where the CEO talks about how awesome the company is he starts talking about reality and finally admits "Houston we have a problem"..."but we are focusing on the major headwinds by x,y and z strategies." 

 

Nobody is buying the stock today because Cook is in detail of reality.

[Guest valueInv]

  On 6/22/2013 at 10:39 PM, wellmont said:

  Quote

 

I'm throwing out ballpark numbers- I sure you can figure out from the fact they nice round numbers, right?

 

Here's another one -

 

Over the next 10 years, he will have to add almost 3 Berkshires worth of market cap to collect $300M.

 

I'm sure a genius like you will find that easy, but Cook is just your average everyday CeO. ;)

 

Yes it may help to be more precise with your numbers. I think you may be getting hung up with the big numbers. he is starting with $390b. he has $120b of cash in the bank. he has one of the top 3 brands in the world. he has $40b of new capital a year to allocate. he did not produce that $40b. all he has to do is invest it. he has a global distribution system, an r & d pipeline in place, and people to produce and sell new products.

 

the Large numbers sound daunting. but it's the percentages that matter not the absolute numbers. and the fact is he does not have to do heroic things to make extraordinary amounts of money. more power to him. the ceo of apple deserves to make a lot of money.

 

surely you think he can do as well as the average s n p 500 ceo?  you aren't in this to make 10% a year I gather.

 

But as you have oft repeated, there are sooooo many reasons why they will have a low multiple  ::)

 

Watch out, you're beginning to sound like a fanboi ;)

[Guest valueInv]

  On 6/22/2013 at 11:25 PM, kevin4u2 said:

  Quote

  Quote

Just how much value has he added since becoming CEO?

 

Take a look at their financials

 

Flat and falling profits. Margins dripping hard in a very competitive industry. Living off the coattails and products of Steve Jobs. Stock has been hammered as a result... 300 million will do.

 

I'll tell you what it would take for me to be interested in Apple. Instead of the usually conference call where the CEO talks about how awesome the company is he starts talking about reality and finally admits "Houston we have a problem"..."but we are focusing on the major headwinds by x,y and z strategies." 

 

Nobody is buying the stock today because Cook is in detail of reality.

 

 

Compare metrics to the point he took over the CEO. If you want to be realistic, compare to atleast a year before he was CEO because he was running Apple way before he had the title.

Actions speak louder than words.

 

Like I've told Welmount, keep watching.

 

BTW, he has the potential to be a better CEO than Jobs.

[hardincap]

A great CEO not only runs the biz effectively but manages the co's story effectively. Cook hasn't been doing well at the latter. He needs to come out of his shell and be more aggressive.

 

Even Buffett does his part by running annual shareholders meeting and granting plenty of interviews to the media.

 

 

[Guest valueInv]

  On 6/23/2013 at 12:04 AM, hardincap said:

A great CEO not only runs the biz effectively but manages the co's story effectively. Cook hasn't been doing well at the latter. He needs to come out of his shell and be more aggressive.

 

Even Buffett does his part by running annual shareholders meeting and granting plenty of interviews to the media.

 

Apple many reasons to be secretive, they have a different business environment. I welcome the stock price being low as long as they are buying back. Cooks silence is likely to benefit long term shareholders more than noise.

 

 

Try to get Buffet to talk about IV.

[hardincap]

not mutually exclusive. theres PLENTY of things cook can say to defend apple w/o spilling secrets. like smack down eric schmidt's comment on how android will win because of its dominant marketshare. jobs would clearly be on the attack, calling android things like grand theft android. cook, nothing.

 

buybacks: 15% outstanding over 2.5 years is not reason to let stock crash and not worry about it

 

  On 6/23/2013 at 12:09 AM, valueInv said:

  Quote

A great CEO not only runs the biz effectively but manages the co's story effectively. Cook hasn't been doing well at the latter. He needs to come out of his shell and be more aggressive.

 

Even Buffett does his part by running annual shareholders meeting and granting plenty of interviews to the media.

 

Apple many reasons to be secretive, they have a different business environment. I welcome the stock price being low as long as they are buying back. Cooks silence is likely to benefit long term shareholders more than noise.

 

 

Try to get Buffet to talk about IV.

[Guest valueInv]

  On 6/23/2013 at 12:15 AM, hardincap said:

not mutually exclusive. theres PLENTY of things cook can say to defend apple w/o spilling secrets. like smack down eric schmidt's comment on how android will win because of its dominant marketshare. jobs would clearly be on the attack, calling android things like grand theft android. cook, nothing.

 

buybacks: 15% outstanding over 2.5 years is not reason to let stock crash and not worry about it

 

  Quote

  Quote

A great CEO not only runs the biz effectively but manages the co's story effectively. Cook hasn't been doing well at the latter. He needs to come out of his shell and be more aggressive.

 

Even Buffett does his part by running annual shareholders meeting and granting plenty of interviews to the media.

 

Apple many reasons to be secretive, they have a different business environment. I welcome the stock price being low as long as they are buying back. Cooks silence is likely to benefit long term shareholders more than noise.

 

 

Try to get Buffet to talk about IV.

 

Raking mud at a competitor is not always good marketing, especially when you have a premium position. You end up giving them free publicity.

 

Plus, it's not Cooks style. Just like Buffet rarely speaks ill of anyone.

[DCG]

  On 6/22/2013 at 11:25 PM, kevin4u2 said:

  Quote

  Quote

Just how much value has he added since becoming CEO?

 

Take a look at their financials

 

Flat and falling profits. Margins dripping hard in a very competitive industry. Living off the coattails and products of Steve Jobs. Stock has been hammered as a result... 300 million will do.

 

I'll tell you what it would take for me to be interested in Apple. Instead of the usually conference call where the CEO talks about how awesome the company is he starts talking about reality and finally admits "Houston we have a problem"..."but we are focusing on the major headwinds by x,y and z strategies." 

 

Nobody is buying the stock today because Cook is in detail of reality.

 

Only $43.6 billion in revenue last quarter. Seems like a 'huge problem'.

[Guest valueInv]

  On 6/23/2013 at 2:08 AM, DCG said:

  Quote

  Quote

  Quote

Just how much value has he added since becoming CEO?

 

Take a look at their financials

 

Flat and falling profits. Margins dripping hard in a very competitive industry. Living off the coattails and products of Steve Jobs. Stock has been hammered as a result... 300 million will do.

 

I'll tell you what it would take for me to be interested in Apple. Instead of the usually conference call where the CEO talks about how awesome the company is he starts talking about reality and finally admits "Houston we have a problem"..."but we are focusing on the major headwinds by x,y and z strategies." 

 

Nobody is buying the stock today because Cook is in detail of reality.

 

Only $43.6 billion in revenue last quarter. Seems like a 'huge problem'.

 

Such a disaster :P He needs to explain to shareholders why it's so low, dammit!!!