RichardGibbons

Unless you literally intend "higher" to mean "some God who by definition is always right", then this is a pretty silly argument. (If that is what you're claiming, then, yay, circular argument!) I'm not sure why anyone at all would seriously believe higher moral standards need to be inextricably tied to a deity, unless they need to use that deity to justify doing something immoral.

That's interesting. I think this is the first time I've "met" someone who thinks it's fine to fly both the ISIS flag and the Nazi flag. I am a fan of protecting peoples rights and freedoms afforded to them by the constitution. Peoples rights should not change like stock prices based on the flavor of the month or the rotation of parties in power. They should be unassailable and without question. I really dont care about the flag issue. Like, in the course of things that are important in my life, saying its not even on the radar would still be giving it too much priority. If all flags are banned I would get by just fine, and if anyone was allowed to display any flag they wanted, I wouldn't care either. I just think its worth noting how fundamentally hypocritical a lot of people are. I mean, was there just, for the past few years, this massive deal made by some about how taking a knee was fine because "the flag doesnt mean to you what it means to me"? And now, many of those same people are claiming that, "this is what the flag means to me so thats what it has to mean to you"! At the end of the day, if we are consistent, let people fly whatever flag they want, no different than how we can also let Twitter ban or modify content from whoever they want, bakeries can chose to sell cakes to whomever they want, and Sanjeev can choose who gets to be a part of CoBF. From there, society, and the laws of supply and demand will determine the viability of those behaviors, and if, a for profit organization(arguable in Twitters case), people can vote "this is unacceptable" and give the proverbial thumbs down by choosing to take their business elsewhere. Interesting perspective--I think it is consistent. I really like that you're owning the idea, and not backing down just because the consequences are pretty nauseating.

Lockdown is very hard on many people. It is one thing to say open your shop and have good ventilation. Another to say shut your shop and sit at home. So, are you "pro-mask" then? You seem to change the subject whenever anyone mentions masks. IMO, shutting down was a no-brainer at the start, and now opening shops while requiring masks in public enclosed spaces (and ideally good ventilation) is also a no brainer.

That's interesting. I think this is the first time I've "met" someone who thinks it's fine to fly both the ISIS flag and the Nazi flag.

Clearly this is true. The Confederation used the flag from 1863 to 1865. People care a lot about it now because it can be used to show hate, not because 150 years ago, people's long-dead ancestors used it for three years.

Bonnie Henry, British Columbia's pandemic leader--who's likely the single person most responsible for BC's success against COVID-19--has said that there hasn't been a pandemic in recorded history that hasn't had a second wave. I have no idea if that's hyperbole, or something built into the definition of pandemic (like, if it doesn't have a second wave, it isn't problematic enough to be called a pandemic). But I'm inclined to believe her.

I love that you didn't include a period at the end of this rant. It adds imagery of your face turning red, spittle flying everywhere. You're so furious at those damn liberals that Fox tells you are ruining the world that words and more words just need to spew out.

The irony is that because of who Trump is, and how his supporters act, it isn't too late for him to support masks. Trump constantly flips positions, and his propaganda network pretends his previous statements don't exist, and his supporters all jump in line. And there's no real political cost to him from flip-flopping. (The non-Trump supporters largely don't need to be persuaded, since the mostly understand science and accepting mild inconvenience for the greater good.) So, if Trump did reverse his position, it would probably work out quite well. But he won't, because he's vain.

It's worthwhile noting that Investor20 is right about the masks. There's a huge amount of value to everyone just wearing masks. That said, it's now a political issue so it will be hard to get everyone wearing masks, but it's still worth doing it.

One interesting contrast for the crowd who believes that the whole world is out to get Trump is the reaction to Doug Ford, the premier of Ontario. When Ford was elected, people were literally calling him "Donald Trump of the North" (for the obvious reasons: a populist, conservative, not too bright, loves applause....) Nevertheless, in general, the media has been lauding Ford for his efforts on COVID-19. Most of the reporting is basically, "wow, this guy can actually deal with a crisis and govern." It's an interesting contrast, particularly considering that, Canada's media is to the left of America's. I think the main difference--to those who actually care about objective reality--is that this crisis has revealed Trump's incompetence. It's essentially a crisis tailor-made to fit Trump's weaknesses. In contrast, it's revealed Ford's competence and perhaps a difference in willingness to listen to experts.

Let me ask Investor20 a few questions: Can people get COVID-19 when they never have contact with someone who is infected? If you are in your house with uninfected people, will the virus magically teleport through the walls into your bloodstream? Do you really believe this ridiculous argument you keep making and everyone keeps ignoring because it's so stupid? I mean, I get it. You really want the world to reopen. Sure, it's better being outside with someone who is infected than being inside with someone who is infected. But it's better not coming into contact with infected people at all.

Cool story, dude. Let's keep going! Now tell us why Xi Jinping, Vladimir Putin, and Kim Jong-un are persecuted and misunderstood, and how their actions are all the fault of that darn Liberal media.

LOL, yeah, me too. I still think it's a pretty accurate description.

That there were hundreds of thousands or millions of cases of COVID-19 in the USA in February or early March and that it wasn't a big deal. We now know what hundreds of thousands or millions of cases of COVID-19 looks like, and it wasn't what it looked like back then. (Same answer as last time.)

My theory is that it's because the Japanese are culturally socially distanced compared to most other cultures and are also happy to wear masks. Do you have any other theories, Investor20?

You've been proven wrong, and still won't acknowledge it. It's pretty clear that only data that supports your old arguments matter to you.

Really, it's just shameful, so embarrassing. I'm baffled that people would make such ridiculous arguments. If someone wants to defend Trump, why don't they actually make arguments that are at least somewhat credible? He's done some good stuff, so why on earth would they make stupid arguments that don't stand up at all? I mean, there's a reason that they support him, right? So why don't they talk about the good, solid reasons they have for supporting him rather than tossing out all this stuff that nobody with an ounce of brains would believe?

The video's amusing, but clearly propaganda. Both the CCP and Trump screwed up, and spinning it as entirely a USA problem is pretty ridiculous. The thing is, because of polarized politics in the USA, a significant number of Americans may support this propaganda. Putin certainly got his money's worth.

I'm pretty well always mucking around with something that interests me, but isn't actually profitable. Usually that activity can be used as a descriptor that satisfies people. e.g. when I was writing novels, I said I was a writer. Now that I'm playing around with reinforcement learning, I say that I'm working on machine learning. The question usually isn't phrased as "How do you make money?", and more like "What do you do?". So saying what I'm focusing on is an honest response. Also, as I get closer to 50, it's a bit more acceptable to say, "I'm semi-retired". Thus, the answer can depend on what sort of interaction or relationship I want with the other person.

I agree with this. In BC in particular, I think they are too slow in relaxing restrictions. It's quite clear now that the curve has flattened, and it's at the point where high-priority operations should start, and lower-risk non-essential services should open (with masks and distancing.) There is no hope in BC of successfully emulating New Zealand's strategy of attempting zero cases, so the optimal strategy is to slowly reopen, and see what happens. (It would be interesting knowing what epidemiologists' arguments against a gradual reopening starting tomorrow would be.)

The other interesting black swan thing that people aren't talking about is that the more people who get this, the higher the chance of the disease mutating in a noteworthy way. That could be good (mutating into something that is even more infectious, not deadly, but gives immunity for all variants) or bad (same as now, but more deadly).

Yeah, this is still stupidity and not common sense, as you were told a few days ago, a few days before that, a few days before that.... It is not possible to inflect a large part of society while keeping the at-risk population safe.

I swear, it'll be the most incomprehensible Presidential debate of all time.

This is a noteworthy data point that I didn't keep up on--I thought it was always 6, not 14. Thanks for the update, Spekulatius .

Assuming you didn't lie about the transcript, these are his exact words: "I see disinfectant, where it knocks it out in a minute, one minute, and is there a way we can do something like that by injection inside, or almost a cleaning." You're arguing that he didn't say that it might be a good idea to inject a disinfectant. He did say it. It's very clear, even if he later regretted saying it a few minutes later. I'm baffled why you wouldn't just say, "Oops I was wrong. He did say it, though he later backpedaled."